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Post by NIGHTBRINGER on Nov 1, 2017 14:38:33 GMT
This makes me curious. I wonder how they built their WE list to be competitive. I am full aware that my losses most likely comes down to me being a bad general/low experience with both my own and my opponents units to know when to attack and win or expect to loose. Wild Riders make an exceptional and super swift hammer and aren't that expensive in points. I didn't see a single 'competitive' 8th Wood Elf army which didn't feature at least one unit of them. I'm sure the builds varied a bit but they all seemed to feature Wild Riders. Agreed, Wild Riders are a very potent unit. Definitely glass hammers, but they can put out a ton of damage on the charge. I also think that Waywatchers are a great unit in the Wood Elves book. Those guys can be nasty, especially when backed up by the right magic spell.
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Post by henning on Nov 1, 2017 15:14:03 GMT
Also, trueflight arrows are really good. Combined with one unit with flaming arrows and a few waywatcher units. you can take on basically any army. +1 for multiple wildrider units
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Post by NIGHTBRINGER on Nov 1, 2017 20:34:34 GMT
Also, trueflight arrows are really good. Perfect chaff removers! My Skinks definitely don't like those arrows.
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Post by NIGHTBRINGER on Nov 14, 2017 5:44:29 GMT
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Post by mottdon on Nov 14, 2017 12:59:52 GMT
That provides a great visual as to how each army is viewed! Thanks for putting that together!
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Post by wilsonthenarc on Nov 14, 2017 13:18:42 GMT
I LOL'ed at Empire. Only got votes for the middle. Nothing too good, nothing too bad. Completely fair.
I mean, I knew Dark Elves would skew towards "Really Good"... But the Empire is just so fantastically moderate, I love it.
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Post by mottdon on Nov 14, 2017 17:45:12 GMT
That's where they should be IMO! They are the average beat-stick that everyone else is measured off of!
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Post by NIGHTBRINGER on Nov 15, 2017 1:34:47 GMT
The big surprise for me was how badly the Wood Elves fared.
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Post by Naitsabes on Nov 15, 2017 3:43:33 GMT
The big surprise for me was how badly the Wood Elves fared. Well it looked like only five people had an opinion on them to begin with. I guess that is fitting for shadowy forest dwellers
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Post by NIGHTBRINGER on Nov 15, 2017 3:57:01 GMT
The big surprise for me was how badly the Wood Elves fared. Well it looked like only five people had an opinion on them to begin with. I guess that is fitting for shadowy forest dwellers That is true. Which means that they likely sit somewhere in between two tiers. The question is do they sit between the upper & middle tiers or between the middle & lower tiers? The votes would seem to indicate the latter, but I personally feel it should be the former.
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Post by mottdon on Nov 15, 2017 5:01:08 GMT
Well, Wood Elves can run at both extremes, depending on WHO's playing them. In certain, experienced general's hands, they can be just about impossible to beat! But in an unexperiences players hands they can seem like a horrible army. They can really tell you a lot about yourself as a player.....(MWAH-HA-HA-HA!!!)
I think that's why most find them difficult to rank, because there can be such a multitude of results!
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Post by NIGHTBRINGER on Nov 15, 2017 6:40:48 GMT
Well, Wood Elves can run at both extremes, depending on WHO's playing them. In certain, experienced general's hands, they can be just about impossible to beat! But in an unexperiences players hands they can seem like a horrible army. They can really tell you a lot about yourself as a player.....(MWAH-HA-HA-HA!!!) I think that's why most find them difficult to rank, because there can be such a multitude of results! I think you are correct. They are a potent force but they are far from forgiving. Tactical mistakes cost you big time with Wood Elves. I also thought that Ogres would have fared a bit better. I figured they would land a few spots higher, bordering just below the true upper tier. I figured Tomb Kings would do poorly, but it's sad to see them land dead (pun intended) last. I thought they might have Beastmen beat and perhaps compete with the Bretonnians. They definitely belong in the bottom 3 though.
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Post by mottdon on Nov 15, 2017 10:58:47 GMT
Yeah, I agree with you on the Ogres. They probably should be swapped with DoC. Heck, I'd even place WE, VC and O&G over DoC, but I suppose others have seen something with them that I just haven't.
And, yes, I think Beastmen and TK are really flipped as well. Personally, I think they hurt from not having more "resurrection" type spells. I have seen then used with a great degree of success though.
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Post by knoffles on Nov 15, 2017 12:57:27 GMT
Wood elves might also be down to player exposure considering how close the new book came out to the end times. That combined with the aforementioned unforgiving nature of the army.
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Post by grandmasterwang on Nov 16, 2017 12:37:23 GMT
Well, Wood Elves can run at both extremes, depending on WHO's playing them. In certain, experienced general's hands, they can be just about impossible to beat! But in an unexperiences players hands they can seem like a horrible army. They can really tell you a lot about yourself as a player.....(MWAH-HA-HA-HA!!!) I think that's why most find them difficult to rank, because there can be such a multitude of results! I think you are correct. They are a potent force but they are far from forgiving. Tactical mistakes cost you big time with Wood Elves. I also thought that Ogres would have fared a bit better. I figured they would land a few spots higher, bordering just below the true upper tier. I figured Tomb Kings would do poorly, but it's sad to see them land dead (pun intended) last. I thought they might have Beastmen beat and perhaps compete with the Bretonnians. They definitely belong in the bottom 3 though. I think Tomb Kings were voted down to last due to the combination of no marching, general crumble and the crucial rule that if the Heirophant dies the whole army starts to crumble, giving them somewhat of an 'I lose' button to go with their other drawbacks.... which they really didn't need. One of the reasons that Wood Elves might have been voted lower than High/Dark elves is that while they are (imo) very good at winning games, it is (imo) significantly harder for them to destroy/table enemy armies than it is for their high/dark brethren. When I play Chillhammer with my friends, we bring Tomb Kings, Beastmen, High Elves and Dark Elves all closer to the middle so I'm glad these results support the changes we've made. Ogres would have been rated top/high tier soon after they're book came out. At that time all their enemy armies had stompable core and OK had the best monstrous cavalry plus greedy fist shenanigans. Later they fixed the Greedy fist thing and armies like WOC came out with even better monstrous cavalry and easier access to less stompable armies, diminishing the OK initial advantages so bringing the army down. Id still put them mid-upper tier though.
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