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Post by lordofskullpass on Apr 17, 2019 13:30:31 GMT
500 point Tomb Kings, not as terrible as I'd thought: - Liche Priest (Hierophant), Level 2 Lore of Nehekara - 105 points
- 15 Skeleton Warriors, light armour - 75 points
- 10 Skeleton Archers - 60 points
- 3 Skeleton Chariots, Musician - 175 points
- 1 Tomb Scorpion - 85 points
Sorry to necro this thread in advance, only just looked at it after viewing larabic's Slow Grow campaign thread that featured 500 pt armies. That's an nice thematic list there, but I would say that the small units of Skeletons are going to get picked off quite easily there. I've been doing some theoryhammering for TK just at this moment and have thought of a good list: Liche Priest (Hierophant), Level 2 Lore of Nehekhara - 105 points 20 Skeleton Warriors, light armour, shields, spears, FC - 170 points 20 Archers, FC - 150 points 3 Carrion - 74 points Total: 499 Kept with the Level 2 Heirophant - he can have another spell then to buff the unit better. Just thought having larger units and making the warriors more durable will help to protect him for longer though against stronger melee fighters. If you put him in the Warrior unit so that you have 21, you can arrange them in a 7x3 formation to allow all the Warriors to attack with their spears, making for a stronger melee unit, and the archers you can have in 10x2 or similar to get a good lot of arrows firing (you'll need them when you're hitting on straight 5s otherwise you'll feel like a 40K Ork player). The Carrion I put in to fill the last 75 points in the army, and thought would just be a nice touch to have a faster flanking unit in there knowing how slow Tomb Kings can be. I know they're not that good in melee but can be used to engage a unit in the flank or rear just as the Warriors charge in the front to help tip the balance of the melee, and are pretty cheap too. This sort of army still teaches a new player about most of the requirements, and they can also get to have fun with spears as something they may not already know (I don't have TK myself but have found a PDF of the Army Book online so have downloaded it for a bit of theoryhammering as I like them a lot, and Mantic's Empire of Dust range looks pretty good as a substitute for an aspiring TK newbie like myself now that GW have sentenced their own models to non-undeath). |
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Post by grandmasterwang on May 8, 2019 3:14:04 GMT
500 point Tomb Kings, not as terrible as I'd thought: - Liche Priest (Hierophant), Level 2 Lore of Nehekara - 105 points
- 15 Skeleton Warriors, light armour - 75 points
- 10 Skeleton Archers - 60 points
- 3 Skeleton Chariots, Musician - 175 points
- 1 Tomb Scorpion - 85 points
Sorry to necro this thread in advance, only just looked at it after viewing larabic's Slow Grow campaign thread that featured 500 pt armies. That's an nice thematic list there, but I would say that the small units of Skeletons are going to get picked off quite easily there. I've been doing some theoryhammering for TK just at this moment and have thought of a good list: Liche Priest (Hierophant), Level 2 Lore of Nehekhara - 105 points 20 Skeleton Warriors, light armour, shields, spears, FC - 170 points 20 Archers, FC - 150 points 3 Carrion - 74 points Total: 499 Kept with the Level 2 Heirophant - he can have another spell then to buff the unit better. Just thought having larger units and making the warriors more durable will help to protect him for longer though against stronger melee fighters. If you put him in the Warrior unit so that you have 21, you can arrange them in a 7x3 formation to allow all the Warriors to attack with their spears, making for a stronger melee unit, and the archers you can have in 10x2 or similar to get a good lot of arrows firing (you'll need them when you're hitting on straight 5s otherwise you'll feel like a 40K Ork player). The Carrion I put in to fill the last 75 points in the army, and thought would just be a nice touch to have a faster flanking unit in there knowing how slow Tomb Kings can be. I know they're not that good in melee but can be used to engage a unit in the flank or rear just as the Warriors charge in the front to help tip the balance of the melee, and are pretty cheap too. This sort of army still teaches a new player about most of the requirements, and they can also get to have fun with spears as something they may not already know (I don't have TK myself but have found a PDF of the Army Book online so have downloaded it for a bit of theoryhammering as I like them a lot, and Mantic's Empire of Dust range looks pretty good as a substitute for an aspiring TK newbie like myself now that GW have sentenced their own models to non-undeath). I think that's a good list for 500pts. The flying option will make a difference. I also like sedge's list as chariots are awesome. |
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Post by alanthemoderate on May 8, 2019 9:50:07 GMT
And here's a High Elf list to try out: 500 High Elf army: Noble (Dragon Armor, Shield of the Merwyrm, Khaine's Ring of Fury) - 120 17 Spearmen - 153 5 Ellyrian Reavers (Replace Spears with Bows) - 85 Tiranoc Chariot - 70 Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower - 70 I know is a little necro, but is this a good High Elf Army to start out with? I am looking into it for a 'friend' of mine. |
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Post by crownprinceimrik on May 8, 2019 10:32:33 GMT
I'm not the biggest fan of that High Elf list. The Noble should be alright and the Spearmen too as well as the Bolt Thrower, but I don't like the Reavers or the Chariot. Reavers as chaff aren't necessary at 500 points and they die just as fast as spearmen without hitting any harder so I wouldn't use them. The Chariot in isolation is fine, but it will have some trouble when scaling the list up to higher points and it is still quite frail. I'd replace the Reavers and the Chariot with either some Dragon Princes or maybe some Swordmasters to give the list more hitting power.
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Post by knoffles on May 8, 2019 12:51:48 GMT
And here's a High Elf list to try out: 500 High Elf army: Noble (Dragon Armor, Shield of the Merwyrm, Khaine's Ring of Fury) - 120 17 Spearmen - 153 5 Ellyrian Reavers (Replace Spears with Bows) - 85 Tiranoc Chariot - 70 Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower - 70 I know is a little necro, but is this a good High Elf Army to start out with? I am looking into it for a 'friend' of mine. I’m not necessarily a fan of the titanic chariot but the aim of these lists is to try and get a bit of everything in to allow new players to try out as much as possible, so it has cavalry, a bit of shooting, a war machine, a chariot, the magic ring makes up for the lack of mage etc. I’d say they are also not meant to be particularly competitive or perhaps I should say they are not meant to be hard lists. |
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Post by mottdon on May 8, 2019 13:04:57 GMT
Well, I e had success with this list, but mostly because it has fast elements that can harass with shooting, thin and significantly weaken their ranks, then pile in for flank and rear attacks. It also gives you more options and threats that your opponent has to deal with and more ways to handle all those ranks of Skaven Slaves or Goblins that you might face.
5 Dragon Princes will be a good hammer option as well though, but takes away a lot of your shooting options. They hit hard though! Might be a better option against heavily armored armies like Brets, Dwarfs, or WoC.
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Post by lordofskullpass on May 8, 2019 14:41:07 GMT
I've just been theoryhammering Bretonnians (again with a PDF of the army book I found) and came up with this list: - Paladin with shield, Gromril Greathelm, Sword of Might
- 11 Knights of the Realm with FC
- 20 Men-at-arms with Yeoman Warden
This comes to 500 points on the nose. There is no magic, I know, but the Paladin is pretty beast in combat with permanent Strength 5 and a 1+ armour save (Gromril Greathelm adds an additional 1 to armour save after being mounted on barded steed with heavy armour and shield), and with a mighty unit of 11 knights to back him up, that makes a pretty dangerous 3x4 lance formation. The 20 Men-at-arms can be given halberds or spears for free so can be used to just generally be annoying and stop the Paladin's knight unit from being flanked, which should be a bit easier if the Men-at-arms keep close by as they can then use the unit's mighty leadership of 8 rather than their Skaven leadership of 6. |
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Post by crownprinceimrik on May 8, 2019 15:45:06 GMT
I've just been theoryhammering Bretonnians (again with a PDF of the army book I found) and came up with this list: - Paladin with shield, Gromril Greathelm, Sword of Might
- 11 Knights of the Realm with FC
- 20 Men-at-arms with Yeoman Warden
This comes to 500 points on the nose. There is no magic, I know, but the Paladin is pretty beast in combat with permanent Strength 5 and a 1+ armour save (Gromril Greathelm adds an additional 1 to armour save after being mounted on barded steed with heavy armour and shield), and with a mighty unit of 11 knights to back him up, that makes a pretty dangerous 3x4 lance formation. The 20 Men-at-arms can be given halberds or spears for free so can be used to just generally be annoying and stop the Paladin's knight unit from being flanked, which should be a bit easier if the Men-at-arms keep close by as they can then use the unit's mighty leadership of 8 rather than their Skaven leadership of 6. That army list is unfortunately illegal as all armies must have at least 3 units in addition to any lords and heroes, though you might be able to talk to an opponent about bypassing that rule considering the low points total. |
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Post by TheGreatHornedRat on May 8, 2019 17:05:29 GMT
Warriors of Chaos: - Chaos Sorcerer, Level 1, Lore of Fire - 110 points
- 10 x Chaos Warriors, Shields, Full Command - 180 points
- 5 x Chaos Knights, Musician - 210 points
It's a nasty list, but has the two iconic starter units most new players are most likely to want to field - Warriors and Knights. - Chaos Sorcerer, Level 1, Lore of Fire - 110 points
- 15 x Chaos Warriors, Shields, Full Command - 255 points
- 5 x Marauder Horsemen, Throwing Axes, Spears, Shields Musician - 100 points
- 5 x Chaos Warhounds, Mutant Poisons - 35 points
That's an alternative that drops the Knights for more warriors, and a couple of lighter fast-moving units, also giving you a shooting attack. The first one is also illegal, as there aren't 3 units. I'd maybe...ditch the full command and drop the Warriors down to 6 models (can you? I don't know the min size for warriors) and with the spare points add...dogs for warmachine hunting? |
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Post by lordofskullpass on May 8, 2019 18:38:18 GMT
I've just been theoryhammering Bretonnians (again with a PDF of the army book I found) and came up with this list: - Paladin with shield, Gromril Greathelm, Sword of Might
- 11 Knights of the Realm with FC
- 20 Men-at-arms with Yeoman Warden
This comes to 500 points on the nose. There is no magic, I know, but the Paladin is pretty beast in combat with permanent Strength 5 and a 1+ armour save (Gromril Greathelm adds an additional 1 to armour save after being mounted on barded steed with heavy armour and shield), and with a mighty unit of 11 knights to back him up, that makes a pretty dangerous 3x4 lance formation. The 20 Men-at-arms can be given halberds or spears for free so can be used to just generally be annoying and stop the Paladin's knight unit from being flanked, which should be a bit easier if the Men-at-arms keep close by as they can then use the unit's mighty leadership of 8 rather than their Skaven leadership of 6. That army list is unfortunately illegal as all armies must have at least 3 units in addition to any lords and heroes, though you might be able to talk to an opponent about bypassing that rule considering the low points total. That makes sense, as it prevents any single-unit horde deathstars being used at such a low points limit. In that case, I've thought of some other lists. The first one is the most all-comers configuration: - General: Paladin with shield, Gromril Greathelm and Sword of Might
- 5 Knights of the Realm with Gallant
- 25 Men-at-arms with Standard Bearer and Yeoman Warden
- 20 Peasant Bowmen
This comes to 499 points - you only get 6 cavalry now, but your Men-at-arms get some extra blokes and an all-important Standard Bearer and you have a good-sized unit of archers to provide missile support.
The second tries to demonstrate the superiority of Bretonnian cavalry more while still keeping the infantry units:
- General: Paladin with shield, Gromril Greathelm and Sword of Might
- 8 Knights of the Realm with Gallant
- 20 Men-at-arms with Standard Bearer and Yeoman Warden
- 12 Peasant Bowmen
This one comes to 498 points, and relies on your knight unit a bit more as you have a smaller missile unit, but the knight unit has more punch and can take a war machine hit more easily, while the 12 archers don't cost many points at all so aren't of much consequence if they die early on. The final one is a full cavalry list if you really want display Bretonnia's superior horsemanship: - General: Paladin with shield, Gromril Greathelm and Sword of Might
- 5 Knights of the Realm with Gallant
- 6 Knights of the Realm with Gallant
- 5 Knights of the Realm with Gallant
Put your paladin in one of the units of 5 knights and you've got 2 3x2 lances and one unit of 5 that can be deployed all in a line. This one comes in at 496 points and is a lot smaller in size, but has some notable advantages over the other two - you have no need to slow your knights down to 8" so you can gallop 16" full pelt towards your foe and get the charge in earlier, your army as a whole is a lot more durable with 2+ saves all round, and your army is also a lot braver. The problem with the previous two armies above is that the peasant units rely a lot on the single knight unit to deal the heavy hit and keep their morale up - if that knight unit with your general in it somehow dies or routs, your peasant units are going to have a much harder time of it. In this list, on the other hand, your 3 knight units don't need to rely upon each other - you can always concentrate multiple units of them to focus your charges on a single target, but each of your 3 units can also reliably deal with many threats on their own. |
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Post by grandmasterwang on May 9, 2019 2:57:51 GMT
That army list is unfortunately illegal as all armies must have at least 3 units in addition to any lords and heroes, though you might be able to talk to an opponent about bypassing that rule considering the low points total. That makes sense, as it prevents any single-unit horde deathstars being used at such a low points limit. In that case, I've thought of some other lists. The first one is the most all-comers configuration: - General: Paladin with shield, Gromril Greathelm and Sword of Might
- 5 Knights of the Realm with Gallant
- 20 Men-at-arms with Standard Bearer and Yeoman Warden
- 20 Peasant Bowmen
This comes to 498 points - you only get 6 cavalry now, but your Men-at-arms get an all-important Standard Bearer and you have a good-sized unit of archers to provide missile support.
The second tries to demonstrate the superiority of Bretonnian cavalry more while still keeping the infantry units:
- General: Paladin with shield, Gromril Greathelm and Sword of Might
- 8 Knights of the Realm with Gallant
- 20 Men-at-arms with Standard Bearer and Yeoman Warden
- 12 Peasant Bowmen
This one also comes to 498 points, and relies on your knight unit a bit more as you have a smaller missile unit, but the knight unit has more punch and can take a war machine hit more easily, while the 12 archers don't cost many points at all so aren't of much consequence if they die early on. The final one is a full cavalry list if you really want display Bretonnia's superior horsemanship: - General: Paladin with shield, Gromril Greathelm and Sword of Might
- 5 Knights of the Realm with Gallant
- 6 Knights of the Realm with Gallant
- 5 Knights of the Realm with Gallant
Put your paladin in one of the units of 5 knights and you've got 2 3x2 lances and one unit of 5 that can be deployed all in a line. This one comes in at 496 points and is a lot smaller in size, but has some notable advantages over the other two - you have no need to slow your knights down to 8" so you can gallop 16" full pelt towards your foe and get the charge in earlier, your army as a whole is a lot more durable with 2+ saves all round, and your army is also a lot braver. The problem with the previous two armies above is that the peasant units rely a lot on the single knight unit to deal the heavy hit and keep their morale up - if that knight unit with your general in it somehow dies or routs, your peasant units are going to have a much harder time of it. In this list, on the other hand, your 3 knight units don't need to rely upon each other - you can always concentrate multiple units of them to focus your charges on a single target, but each of your 3 units can also reliably deal with many threats on their own. I think those lists are all pretty cool. I like both the more varied options and the all knights, all day list. In fact, I think they would be fun to play against each other in a civil war type battle. |
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Post by sedge on May 9, 2019 7:41:26 GMT
Warriors of Chaos: - Chaos Sorcerer, Level 1, Lore of Fire - 110 points
- 10 x Chaos Warriors, Shields, Full Command - 180 points
- 5 x Chaos Knights, Musician - 210 points
It's a nasty list, but has the two iconic starter units most new players are most likely to want to field - Warriors and Knights. - Chaos Sorcerer, Level 1, Lore of Fire - 110 points
- 15 x Chaos Warriors, Shields, Full Command - 255 points
- 5 x Marauder Horsemen, Throwing Axes, Spears, Shields Musician - 100 points
- 5 x Chaos Warhounds, Mutant Poisons - 35 points
That's an alternative that drops the Knights for more warriors, and a couple of lighter fast-moving units, also giving you a shooting attack. The first one is also illegal, as there aren't 3 units. I'd maybe...ditch the full command and drop the Warriors down to 6 models (can you? I don't know the min size for warriors) and with the spare points add...dogs for warmachine hunting? Good spot - I've edited my post to make that clear. Unfortunately Warriors are a minimum unit size of 10, so editing the first list that way wouldn't work. You could instead modify the second to give it more punch by dropping the Horsemen for a Chariot but you'd need to free up 10 points for that from somewhere - probably from dropping the Warriors down to 14 (saving 15 points) and then spending the other 5 points on an Enchanted Shield for the Sorcerer: - Chaos Sorcerer, Level 1, Lore of Fire, Enchanted Shield - 115 points
- 14 x Chaos Warriors, Shields, Full Command - 240 points
- 1 x Chaos Chariot - 110 points
- 5 x Chaos Warhounds, Mutant Poisons - 35 points
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Post by strutsagget on May 9, 2019 8:43:55 GMT
Chaos Dwarfs could be doing this:
mini list
Chaos Dwarfs
Daemonsmith Sorcerer 95
10 Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard: great weapons 150
21 Hobgoblin Cutthroats: musician; bows 109
Magma Cannon 145
499 points
It actually looks pretty brutal at this point level.
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Post by lordofskullpass on May 9, 2019 10:08:43 GMT
Chaos Dwarfs could be doing this: mini listChaos DwarfsDaemonsmith Sorcerer 9510 Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard: great weapons 15021 Hobgoblin Cutthroats: musician; bows 109Magma Cannon 145499 pointsIt actually looks pretty brutal at this point level. My Bretonnian all-knight list would have to gallop at full pelt to take down that Magma cannon as soon as possible!  |
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Post by crownprinceimrik on May 9, 2019 10:15:26 GMT
I'm a bit unsure of Bretonnian rules as I don't have the book, but don't they have to take a mandatory Paladin as a BSB? I thought I remembered reading that somewhere, but cannot be certain.
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