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Post by FvonSigmaringen on May 21, 2020 22:15:23 GMT
So the easy counter for cannons is to block LOS to that point. Preferably by parking a unit just in front of it. Ideally something that can stop a cannonball on the bounce like MI or MC. I never said it was a cheap counter, just an easy one. It is not that easy to block LoS in the 8th edition. And as strutsagget indicates, the cannonball can only be stopped after the bounce - before it is a virtual or quantum cannon ball, that will pass through anything in-between. Perhaps it is best to go through the process step by step: 1. You nominate a target point, which must be within range and with LoS (but with a 360 degree field of view). 2. You roll the artillery die 2.a Misfire -> roll on the Misfire chart: resolve the result, the process ends. 2.b. No misfire: shift the target point in a straight line with the distance rolled (2" to 10"). This is the start of the bounce, and nothing in-between [edit: i.e. between the cannon and the start of the bounce] can stop the cannonball. However, you must avoid hitting a friendly unit or an enemy unit that is engaged in close combat. Therefore, there must not be a friendly unit, or enemy unit in CC between 2" and 20" after the nominated target point. 3. Roll the Artillery die again 3.a. Misfire -> the cannonball stops, but any model at that spot is hit. Do not roll on the Misfire chart. 3.b. No misfire: the cannonball travels the distance rolled, hitting any model in its path, but to a maximum of 1 per rank (front shot) or file (flank shot). However, it will now be stopped, if it encounters obstacles, Monsters/Monstrous models not killed, or impassable terrain like cliffs and buildings. I hope this has clarified the process.
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Post by strutsagget on May 22, 2020 7:37:42 GMT
To make clear though, position a model next to a wall makes sure you opponent can’t do “10 from the back of that” shot unless hitting a 10 on first dice. Think skaven might be different if I remember correctly.
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Post by vulcan on May 24, 2020 22:51:38 GMT
Really, laser-guided cannons are quite silly. They routinely take out many times their points, and rarely fail to make their points back.
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Post by Horace on May 26, 2020 21:33:35 GMT
Buy a laser pointer and insist cannon users use it til hit their nominated points
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Post by vulcan on May 27, 2020 18:50:11 GMT
Which is often easier than you'd think. It's not exactly rare to be able to pick a line of sight clean through a unit of ranked infantry models that are stationary, when the same lone of sight would be obscured by a unit of actual ranked infantry moving around.
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Post by Horace on May 27, 2020 22:09:10 GMT
I actually think it is much more difficult than you make out. True you can often still shoot at the target you wish but often you are not able to hit the mathmatically optimal spot to account for overshoot/ bounce. This all makes a big difference in the chances of removing large pieces
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Post by vulcan on May 28, 2020 18:14:24 GMT
In real life it's WAY more difficult than I make out. Windage alone (gaps between the barrel of the cannon and the cannonball) means a cannon shot will NEVER go precisely where you aim it. Even tight-fitting rifled cannon have accuracy issues for decades.
Then there's the issue of how terrain affects the bounce. Most medieval cannon crews had no idea grazing fire was possible, and even in the early modern era (roughly equivalent to the Empire) a good crew would average 50% of shots bouncing on ideal target terrain. IF the terrain was less than ideal, the odds of a cannon shot bouncing correctly drop enormously. You're not bouncing a cannonball off a lake or other water feature, or a swamp, or other soft ground. Even a freshly plowed field will absorb cannon shot rather than allowing it to bounce. And if there's lots of rocks in that target area, you hit one and your cannonball ricochets off in an unpredictable direction. Shooting into the front slope of a hill tends to either cause the cannonball to embed or ricochet randomly as well. Shooting at the visible crest from a lower level means you're still hitting the front slope, and the actual crest is out of sight unless the cannon is also on a hill at least that tall.
Long and short, hitting a relatively small and mobile target like a single horse, or an individual person, is EXCEEDINGLY unlikely. Hitting a single line of horses in the flank is almost as hard. Yes, hitting something the size of a dragon or other large monster is a bit easier, but we have records of naval battles where you'd fire up to 50 or 60 guns at a ship at point-blank range and miss with over HALF of them...
WFB makes cannon much to accurate to simulate ACTUAL cannon performance. It breaks verisimilitude to have them function more like late 20th century tank guns than period cannon.
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Post by strutsagget on May 29, 2020 14:39:12 GMT
There absolutely should have been a scatter to the point where you aim.
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