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Post by Naitsabes on Jun 24, 2019 17:53:21 GMT
I admit to not reading the battle reports in detail. But, I like the Tzeentch focus here, thanks for putting in the time. Mono-tzeentch I have never pondered. But, now I do. I wonder, if you can't put a thousand+ points into lords (because you were stuck in the old ways of 25% lord), could you still make it work?
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Post by jukei on Jun 24, 2019 17:53:52 GMT
he is winning the battle his Uber had a huge value ( points wise) and I lost 2 Soul grinders 1 Loc and 1 pint horror unit I killed not enough units for also oping in a victory. I wanted to win the combat with my horrors against his last ogre.and ..... in the middle it seemed to be a desperate but not impossible assault. I failed the charge with one vargheists Unit but I succeeded to charge His uber with my LOC with a wand charged ..3 vargheists and champion and my black knights.
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Post by jukei on Jun 24, 2019 17:56:09 GMT
Naitsabes...thanks for your nice post. I will reply you in a while. Stay tuned please...
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Post by jukei on Jun 24, 2019 18:29:53 GMT
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Post by jukei on Jun 24, 2019 18:36:50 GMT
and here we are to last fight... I manage to kill several ogres his BSB his Firebelly BUT His General with Crown IS STILL alive...
( he had several wounds but ...still there)
I win the combat resolution ...
TEST 2D... aannnnnnnnnnnnnnndd....
11! He failed He flees and I pursued with my Knights.. It was a pleasure to see my knights ' lances piercing their hearts...
GAME OVER
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Post by jukei on Jun 24, 2019 18:42:00 GMT
Battle reports or slannesh 😀. I’ve enjoyed reading this. The lore of undead builds were of less relevance but only because no one in our group plays end times (bar the 1.9 errata). Thanks for you nice feedback. One question for you ( and not only for you ) ... Are you playing with "up to 25% of your points total spent in Lords" rule?
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Post by jukei on Jun 24, 2019 18:43:42 GMT
Now it's up to you to choose do you wish A) I gave a tutorial on how to manage power dices with this list ( for instance First turn if we have 7 dices what its preferable to cast before and how many dices to use...etc.) B) do a battle report ( I don't have pics of that tournament but i will try to recollect memories and details ) or I talked C) About Khorne D) Slaanesh/ Tzeentch E) Khorne / slaanesh / tzeentch F) Khorne /slaanesh / Tzeench and Nurgle G)about .... hmm Nothing :-) it was enough thanks! B) We will take your chaos twisted recollections. I hope it was twisted enough! thank you for your thumbs up !
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Post by jukei on Jun 24, 2019 18:45:00 GMT
Battle Reports Mono-Tzeentch is an interesting conundrum, this thread has made me think about it. I think it is a hard army to make work. You really only have troops which can fight attritionally and make use of the wardsave. Otherwise you are reliant on magic-ing away or shooting away the enemy. I think you have to decide on how you are going to approach the battle and really completely tailor your list to it. I think this leaves you 2 options: an evasion list with a MSU approach, or attempting to tarpit the main enemy danger units and pick off the rest - kind of Vampire Count style. The Lord option is also something to ponder - Do you opt for Kairos and give yourself a complete toolkit of magic but sacrifice one of your few decent fighting units in the LoC/Daemon Prince. It's a tricky decision. For the MSU approach I think either Lord option is viable. Kairos covers all eventualities and is very mobile. Multiple horror units would be spaffing magic missiles and DD spells at the enemy, and Flamers, Chariots and Screamers are all pretty fast and mobile. If you are actually going to do some fighting I think the Changeling is worthwhile and having at least some access to the Lore of Metal is vital (if you do not take Kairos that is). Not only for removing any warpflame you may have conferred but also for some access to hexes and augments which the Lore of Tzeentch is lacking. Horrors are not the worst tarpits in the world but unfortunately cost 13 points a piece so you kind of need them to do something. I still think Flamers are one of your better options in this list for a flanking force who can pour out some serious punishment if allowed to get in range. Soulgrinders are also a sound investment. I think Chariots are probably an all-round better investment than units of Screamers. The problem with this approach is that actually putting out 1 big block of Horrors and the rest of your stuff you find your points have not gone very far, so you will probably only be rocking 1 decent(ish) fighting unit
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Post by jukei on Jun 24, 2019 18:54:02 GMT
Hello Horace Thanks for your comment. Look.... I thought exactly these things ...before I started to play mono tzeentch ! Playing this army changed my opinions. I have been playing different lists since months and what on paper seems to be good...unfortunately it's not so effective "in real ".
all this units and options you mentioned ( Kairos included) are ,INMHO, pretty good support in a mixed god army list. I played TZeentch with slaanesh and I can tell you that in this case they worked all pretty well ( chariots ...flamers...and so on) I was really disappointed by our Horrors "fighty "unit with Changelling Horros with loci . I tested several times but it was really awful. Please if you find a better way to play this unit and you can test it with good results let me know! this will change a lot of things. ;-)
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Post by jukei on Jun 24, 2019 19:44:49 GMT
I admit to not reading the battle reports in detail. But, I like the Tzeentch focus here, thanks for putting in the time. Mono-tzeentch I have never pondered. But, now I do. I wonder, if you can't put a thousand+ points into lords (because you were stuck in the old ways of 25% lord), could you still make it work? I am glad you find my posts useful or at least inspiring. Mono tzeentch army is really a funny army ...but can be frustrating .....a lot. I was upset after my first defeats but these defeats pushed me on a way I didn't expected. So I tried Undeath lore and the 50% Lords ( errata end of time) and i liked the results as you could probably read. In this forum, as far as I see, this approach didn't have a warm welcome because maybe people don't play end of times errata . Going to you question... Playing 25 % points Lord will represent an additional limit. Why ? You cannot rely only on shooting and magic. - Shooting is not reliable due to our range.....warp flame rule. We are not wood elves..... dwarves.......and so on..unfortunately. - Magic ( we always need Chromatic tome for manipulating this crucial phase) BUT we can only rely on maxim. 12 dices ( rarely ...often we will have less and some of our spells will be dispelled for sure). Now , assuming each opponents has 1, 2, 3 or more fighting units we won't have chances if we rely only on these resources
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Post by jukei on Jun 24, 2019 19:59:59 GMT
We need also to stand in combat phase somehow
So that's why we need always
2 Soul Grinders ( marked tzeentch obviously )
and we need 2 Lord of changes ( 1 equipped with Wand +chromatic tome ) in order to have at least 4 Units which can finish the enemy or keep it in combat.
Using Kairos can sound good but then we won't have other option (in the Lord section he will drain all points available).
Kairos is also not a fighter...uhmm
I think He is a great Lord but not I am not sure he can save us in a mono Tzeentch army.
if we play 25% lord in a 2400 army list
ONE possible solution is playing LOC 4 LEV Chromatic tome + Wand combo ( 570 points )
Lore of Metal is preferable.
+ 2 Soul Grinders
maybe here I can see flamers also
the drawback is that you will miss a lot the second LOC in combat and as a magic support.
SECOND possible solution is
-2 daemons Princes with chaos armors( 560 points + 1 lesser gifts maybe or flight to one of them ) + 2 heralds to take care of magic phases.
We will keep 4 fighters ( 2 Princes + 2 SoulGrind.) but we will lose the LOC lev 4 with Chromatic tome and wand.
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Post by jukei on Jun 24, 2019 20:09:20 GMT
I hope you all liked the Battle report . I didn't want to make it full of details. I hope it was clear enough and that you were curious to know how it would end. It was a tough game but I enjoyed it a lot.
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Post by knoffles on Jun 25, 2019 8:28:51 GMT
Battle reports or slannesh 😀. I’ve enjoyed reading this. The lore of undead builds were of less relevance but only because no one in our group plays end times (bar the 1.9 errata). Thanks for you nice feedback. One question for you ( and not only for you ) ... Are you playing with "up to 25% of your points total spent in Lords" rule? At the club we play the 50% rule as per the 1.9 errata. It also really helps with Beastmen as allows me to run a Doombull/Great Bray and Beastlord. However I appreciate that we appear to be in the minority on this.
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Post by jukei on Jul 1, 2019 13:10:32 GMT
Thanks knoffles for your reply.
So I hope my suggestions /ideas were useful to someone. Thanks for reading this thread. In case you have questions I will be glad to answer ( if I have one :-) If you find out interesting ideas( not only regarding mono Tzeentch ) please share and post here.
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Post by Horace on Jul 2, 2019 8:37:12 GMT
Have you tried a Wood Elf style evasion list?
With all the discs, flying LoC, Burning chariots, Screamers, skirmishing Flamers etc I think they are set up fairly well for this style.
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