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Post by strutsagget on Sept 25, 2019 11:27:42 GMT
So I am currently toying around with swiftshiver list.
Dual Treemen to hold center(or where needed), dryads and a strong rangers unit can flank. And overloads on shooting and magic.
I am pretty impressed by the staying power of the sisters(even thou people seems to hate them) and love scouts with poison.
List feature a strong magic phase with a mage getting up to +6 to cast.
Combo is swiftshard and lore of high hand of glory to boost BS. They are suppose to be 3 ranks of 8 in the free forest.
Swiftshards Wood Elves
Spellweaver: Level 4 Wizard; Lore of High Magic; Asrai longbow; Book of Ashur 295
Waystalker: The Bow of Loren 110
Glade Captain: Battle Standard Bearer; Asrai spear; starfire shafts; Elven Steed; Hail of Doom Arrow; Enchanted Shield 151
Spellsinger: Lore of Beasts; Dispel Scroll 105
23 Glade Guard: musician; standard bearer; swiftshiver shards 388
12 Dryads 132
12 Dryads 132
28 Wildwood Rangers: Wildwood Warden; musician; standard bearer 338
6 Sisters of the Thorn: musician 166
12 Deepwood Scouts: hagbane tips 192
Treeman: Strangleroots 245
Treeman: Strangleroots 245
2 499 points
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Post by crownprinceimrik on Sept 25, 2019 11:53:37 GMT
I think the list looks fairly solid. Dual Treeman is always good. I don't like the small Dryad units, they seem far too easy to overrun, I'd maybe combine them?
I think Swiftshiver is risky. Every lost elf is twice as much of your firepower lost compared to any other. The list is also heavily reliant on Hand of Glory. If you don't roll it or your opponent prioritizes the dispel it could leave you in trouble on a crucial turn.
Overall I'd say fun and fluffy but not competitive.
You also might be a bit magic heavy. Three casters is a lot and I'd guess the level 4 will draw the majority of the power dice.
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Post by strutsagget on Sept 25, 2019 17:55:21 GMT
I really like small units of dryads, they are flankers or speed bumps and with wild form they become pretty solid. But I have never tried big unit as I have only heard bad things about it. The list is of course not super competitive but I hope it should have game. I still don’t think hand of glory is super necessary. GG is still better then dark shards if not as cheap But I have never tried. Just found out the wording is different on the sisters compared to doomlocks, with no saves at all on miscast so might remove them now.
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Post by strutsagget on Sept 25, 2019 18:12:15 GMT
Maybe something like this instead:
Swiftshards Wood Elves
Spellweaver: Level 4 Wizard; Lore of High Magic; Asrai longbow; Book of Ashur 295
Glade Captain: Battle Standard Bearer; Asrai spear; starfire shafts; Great Stag; Hail of Doom Arrow; Enchanted Shield 206
Spellsinger: Level 2 Wizard; Lore of Beasts; Dispel Scroll 140
23 Glade Guard: musician; standard bearer; swiftshiver shards 388
12 Dryads 132
12 Dryads 132
27 Wildwood Rangers: Wildwood Warden; musician; standard bearer 327
6 Wild Riders: Wild Hunter; musician; standard bearer; shields 198
12 Deepwood Scouts: hagbane tips 192
Treeman: Strangleroots 245
Treeman: Strangleroots 245
2 500 points
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Post by strutsagget on Sept 26, 2019 7:59:23 GMT
Now that I am thinking about it maybe I can run that dryad block big. I am just so afraid of loosing 24 of them in one battle. But as i added wild riders I have a flanking unit.
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Post by knoffles on Sept 26, 2019 22:15:01 GMT
I’ve really enjoyed using the L4 highweaver with book of Ashur and a large block of Swiftshiver glade guard. I do live in fear of not getting the hand of glory but so far I’ve been lucky 😀. Definitely give it a try if you haven’t as yet. The smaller dryad units should also work as chaff to defend the archers
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Post by mottdon on Sept 26, 2019 23:28:35 GMT
Yeah, I like the smaller units of Dryads. You'll need some speed bumps if you want to protect that big block of archers as well as prevent your Treemen from getting ganged up on. And you'll definitely need some chaff units since you don't have any Eagles.
As far as the Sisters go, I love them, but usually only as a bunker for my Lv4. They allow her the mobility to get where she's needed plus a VERY hard bunker to shoot down. You'll definitely need some sort of War Machine hunters in the group, so I like the addition of the Wild Riders better in this case though. You have plenty of firepower with your arrows and Strangleroots, as well as strong Close Combat unit between the Wildwood Rangers, and Treemen, so you won't need to be so reliant on the Wild Riders to be giving you a ton of combat res. If they can clean up war machines and still get some rear charges into combats, then that's game.
One thing I might change is to put your BSB on foot, in with the Rangers, and take an Eagle instead to screen for them. The unit can stick relatively close to the Treemen and he can lend his BSB benefit to them, better than he could if he's charging off on a Great Stag, away from the rest of the army.
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Post by strutsagget on Oct 16, 2019 12:42:40 GMT
So been thinking back and forth so this is the list for now and the game is set tomorrow.
Swiftshards Wood Elves
Spellweaver: Level 4 Wizard; Lore of High Magic; Asrai longbow; Book of Ashur 295
Glade Captain: Battle Standard Bearer; great weapon; shield; starfire shafts; Hail of Doom Arrow; The Other Trickster's Shard 155
Spellsinger: Level 2 Wizard; Lore of Beasts; Asrai longbow; Dispel Scroll 145
20 Glade Guard: musician; standard bearer; swiftshiver shards 340
11 Glade Guard: musician; trueflight arrows 175
12 Dryads 132
6 Wild Riders: Wild Hunter; musician; standard bearer; shields 198
27 Wildwood Rangers: Wildwood Warden; musician; standard bearer 327
12 Deepwood Scouts: hagbane tips 192
Treeman: Strangleroots 245
Treeman: Strangleroots 245
Great Eagle 50
2 499 points
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Post by strutsagget on Oct 19, 2019 4:42:58 GMT
First game did not go well... got blood and glory and lost first turn and game was over before my second turn with a vanguard dark riders horses stupidly killing my general. Pretty sick and tired of games only involving 1 real turn.
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Post by crownprinceimrik on Oct 19, 2019 6:05:22 GMT
That seems strange, your list actually looks pretty solid for Blood and Glory to me. You've got a threshold of 6, you would need to lose more than your general to lose the game. What did the Dark Riders manage to do Turn 1 to take you out? Was the general on its own or something?
Also, for tournament play I've generally seen Blood and Glory give 500 vps instead of ending the game so that single turn games don't happen, maybe that could help some?
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Post by strutsagget on Oct 19, 2019 9:20:25 GMT
That seems strange, your list actually looks pretty solid for Blood and Glory to me. You've got a threshold of 6, you would need to lose more than your general to lose the game. What did the Dark Riders manage to do Turn 1 to take you out? Was the general on its own or something? Also, for tournament play I've generally seen Blood and Glory give 500 vps instead of ending the game so that single turn games don't happen, maybe that could help some? He had first turn and on his second turn Two dark rider managed to make 3 wounds to my mage charging the big gg unit with mage in the flank... i choose not to swift reform (change spot of general) as failure would mean no shooting and I needed that to clear(have to many lost ld test in critical turns). He also managed to to grind my wild riders over two turns with his cold ones getting a charge off after vanguard cleared multiple units in the way. Think have a close to 30-40% unplayable/winnable game after turn 1 this year and it gets pretty frustrating. All from sucked into the warp and killing most of a full unit in the process on 3 dice spell to Forced placement rolled 5 ones against skarsnik with like 12 units total and my Chaos dwards forced to place all wm in one corner undefended and all other 3M in the other corner... try chasing poision skinks with dwarfs for 5 turns
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Post by mottdon on Oct 22, 2019 15:08:31 GMT
I've noticed most of your lists revolve around a Lv4 caster lord who is also acting as your general. Maybe you should try taking a tanky/killy lord character instead of a Lv4? Just take a Lv2 and maybe another Lv1? Just minimize your magic a bit. That'd still give your three spells to cast (I usually don't ever get to cast more than that per turn anyway), and not have all of your eggs in one basket. A tanky lord will make your army hard to break, while a killy lord may give your opponent more pause before charging their vanguarded units in to take out your general (that'd seem a bit pointless). Otherwise, I'd say you're just having some dumb luck. You gotta get back up on that horse, though, if you wanna keep riding! I'd say that I'm like you in that I usually only win about 30% of my games! Lol! It happens, but the victories are so much sweeter! Also, your opponents sound REALLY competitive! Mine are too. But I also like taking sub-par units. Do you play closed lists? Does your opponent know what armies you'll be bringing? After some of your reports I've read, I immediately thought, "That list was totally tailored". Maybe make it a surprise so that he cannot customize his lists. I find that's when I win most of my games. If you do that for a few games and your win percentage goes up, then you know that they were customizing.
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Post by gregwarhamsters on Nov 11, 2019 6:14:09 GMT
I played wood elves years ago, don't really like the new book but sold a lot of my original models - but you know how it is, you start again on looking at your lists and the subtle changes I'm gonna stick my neck out and say I'm not a fan. Thing is I've got 20+ dryads and as you said they just die, stat reduction etc has made them unplayable in my mind. My list is archer heavy so may not be tournament comp legal, I generally go with hagbane or true flight but I don't go for treemen either. too costly. I do however go magic heavy (two sometimes three mages) as you've done so there are a few simular things in my wish list but as said above, theres a lot of "what if's" when you don't get hand of glory or it's dispelled etc. Greg
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Post by strutsagget on Nov 11, 2019 6:54:50 GMT
I've noticed most of your lists revolve around a Lv4 caster lord who is also acting as your general. Maybe you should try taking a tanky/killy lord character instead of a Lv4? Just take a Lv2 and maybe another Lv1? Just minimize your magic a bit. That'd still give your three spells to cast (I usually don't ever get to cast more than that per turn anyway), and not have all of your eggs in one basket. A tanky lord will make your army hard to break, while a killy lord may give your opponent more pause before charging their vanguarded units in to take out your general (that'd seem a bit pointless). Otherwise, I'd say you're just having some dumb luck. You gotta get back up on that horse, though, if you wanna keep riding! I'd say that I'm like you in that I usually only win about 30% of my games! Lol! It happens, but the victories are so much sweeter! Also, your opponents sound REALLY competitive! Mine are too. But I also like taking sub-par units. Do you play closed lists? Does your opponent know what armies you'll be bringing? After some of your reports I've read, I immediately thought, "That list was totally tailored". Maybe make it a surprise so that he cannot customize his lists. I find that's when I win most of my games. If you do that for a few games and your win percentage goes up, then you know that they were customizing. Well I don’t like going killy lord with woodies as they don’t have any good characters for that but might try out a Glade Lord on stag with high armor, ward and ogre blade or when the dragon is finally painted. Too bad the breath is awful on the dragon. But with that said magic is one of woodies strongest phases and I am not a fan of crippling that. Especially when I always face a level 4 on the other side, you need that levels to get anything through. But I do like the swift shivers and will play them again. Even without buff they take out units but they are expensive. Regarding my opponents not sure they are that competitive it’s more they are good at the game and also like to win we usually don’t tailor lists but it is usually pretty easy to know what you will face as we send pictures of what we paint to each other we all have multiple armies so I might hold it more as a secret later on
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Post by Horace on Nov 12, 2019 9:05:06 GMT
I mean that is the risk of going big on magic. If you want to cast the worst spells (for your opponent) you have a fairly decent chance of miscasting. If this is putting at risk a piece that is crucial to your armies success you are going to be in trouble since even the best miscasts will probably put a wound on an already squishy character. Maybe it's because I'm Dawi at heart, but going big on magic has rarely paid off for me.
I would think you can build a pretty killy Glade Lord. The problem I guess is surviving with him.
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