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Post by livewaaaaagh on Oct 28, 2020 17:07:01 GMT
The Tomb Kings roster for Total War: Warhammer is almost complete, but there were two additions that weren't a part of the 8th edition book that I wanted to discuss here today for the sake of conversation and put together a stat line: The Neherkaran Warriors & Horsemen. In game, these come a tier above the regular Skeleton Warriors and Skeleton Horsemen.
The Neherkaran Warriors are equipped with additional hand weapon and have the attributes of anti infantry and "damage dealer". They come at in at a 60% cost premium and have slightly better armor than skeleton warriors, but do not have a shield. So what do you think is a correct stat line and cost?
My take: S3 T3 WS3 Armor save: 5+ Additional Hand weapon (giving them 2 attacks, total)
Special Rules: Armour Piercing
Skeleton Horsemen: These are depicted with a sword and shield and come with a 62.5% cost increase and have the "anti infantry" attribute. This one is tougher for me. I don't think anything calls for more than a regular S3, T3 stat line. So I think the additional cost comes from better armor save. S3 T3 WS3 Armour save: 4+?
Special Rules: Armour Piercing
What's your take?
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Post by lordofskullpass on Oct 29, 2020 14:23:58 GMT
The Tomb Kings roster for Total War: Warhammer is almost complete, but there were two additions that weren't a part of the 8th edition book that I wanted to discuss here today for the sake of conversation and put together a stat line: The Neherkaran Warriors & Horsemen. In game, these come a tier above the regular Skeleton Warriors and Skeleton Horsemen. The Neherkaran Warriors are equipped with additional hand weapon and have the attributes of anti infantry and "damage dealer". They come at in at a 60% cost premium and have slightly better armor than skeleton warriors, but do not have a shield. So what do you think is a correct stat line and cost? My take: S3 T3 WS3 Armor save: 5+ Additional Hand weapon (giving them 2 attacks, total) Special Rules: Armour Piercing Skeleton Horsemen: These are depicted with a sword and shield and come with a 62.5% cost increase and have the "anti infantry" attribute. This one is tougher for me. I don't think anything calls for more than a regular S3, T3 stat line. So I think the additional cost comes from better armor save. S3 T3 WS3 Armour save: 4+? Special Rules: Armour Piercing What's your take? If the Nehekharan Warriors are going to have a 5+ save with extra hand weapons, they'll be wearing heavy armour. This means the Nehekharan Horsemen will have a 3+ save (heavy armour + shield + mounted). Additionally if they're supposed to be a level above regular Skeletons, they should have a Leadership that falls between that of Warriors (5) and Tomb Guard (8), so Leadership 6 or 7 would be good. I like the idea of giving these units rules, though only 2 attacks per model won't make the Nehekharan infantry that much of an anti-infantry unit as only the front rank will get this extra attack. They'll work fine against weak infantry like Empire State Troopers, Goblins and Skaven, but will fare poorly against T4 and above troops like Dwarfs, Saurus and Chaos Warriors, especially as the fact they are Strength 3 base means Armour Piercing will only inflict a -1 penalty to armour save.This may be what you're aiming for anyway, I don't know what you want them to be able to beat in a straight-up fight with the same numbers. The horsemen on the other hand will be a significant cut above bog-standard Skeleton horsemen - Armour Piercing + spears makes them dangerous on the initial charge, and 3+ armour save means they can take a few hits. These will do a lot better against the tougher infantry mentioned above, especially if they charge them in the flank.
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Post by livewaaaaagh on Oct 29, 2020 21:02:18 GMT
Thanks for the message and brainstorming!
Yea, after some thought, there's no way they'd have heavy armour, when Tomb Guard has Light Armour. So 6+ light armour save should remain.
LDR6 sounds good to me, too. so the I think the way you described them, as a unit that would do well against cheap troops but struggle against better units is exactly how they play in Total War. They don't have AP though in game, so I think we remove that and instead give them S4.
That means a stat line of:
S4 T3 WS3 A2 I1 with just light armour and parry for the dual weapons.
Pt wise, Warriors are 4 points, TG are 11. So I'm thinking somewhere around 7-8pts per model.
Thoughts? Ideas?
For the Horsemen, I think they cant have 3+ armour as that's what the much better Necropolis Knights have. So back to LA, Mounted + shield for a respectable 4+. In addition, perhaps a choice of shield or AHW to emulate more the footmen? S4, T3, I1, WS3 Choice of shield or AHW, somehwere in the 30pts per model range?
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Post by KevinC on Oct 30, 2020 22:26:24 GMT
According to the lore they are merely skeleton warriors that form the core of the Tomb Kings Legions. I like your ideas though.
I think you could just do this: Skeleton Warriors may replace their shields with an additional hand weapons for free. Skeleton Warriors armed with two hands weapons have the armour piercing special rule.
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Post by KevinC on Oct 31, 2020 14:22:05 GMT
Thanks for the message and brainstorming! Yea, after some thought, there's no way they'd have heavy armour, when Tomb Guard has Light Armour. So 6+ light armour save should remain. LDR6 sounds good to me, too. so the I think the way you described them, as a unit that would do well against cheap troops but struggle against better units is exactly how they play in Total War. They don't have AP though in game, so I think we remove that and instead give them S4. That means a stat line of: S4 T3 WS3 A2 I1 with just light armour and parry for the dual weapons. Pt wise, Warriors are 4 points, TG are 11. So I'm thinking somewhere around 7-8pts per model. Thoughts? Ideas? For the Horsemen, I think they cant have 3+ armour as that's what the much better Necropolis Knights have. So back to LA, Mounted + shield for a respectable 4+. In addition, perhaps a choice of shield or AHW to emulate more the footmen? S4, T3, I1, WS3 Choice of shield or AHW, somehwere in the 30pts per model range? --------------I'd say 7 points is perfect.
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Post by wilsonthenarc on Dec 1, 2020 21:07:46 GMT
If the Nehekharan Warriors are going to have a 5+ save with extra hand weapons, they'll be wearing heavy armor. This means... I don't think anyone or any unit in the Tomb Kings Army Book gets heavy armor. Not Ushabti. Not Necro Knights. Nobody. Not characters.
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