How to beat Vampire Counts

this is not quite the answer you are looking for but I would consider making the points uneven. so take 2300pts against their lists, if you still beat them use 2200. continue until you reach the point level where your superior grasp of rules balances out with their advantage in numbers. this also means you don't have to deliberately go easy on them and in fact honing your skills with a handicap might turn you into an even leaner, meaner fighting machine.

Also I would recommend using the same list multiple times.

It’s very hard for a newer players to face a new lists.

Thats why of the reason some tournament players favors bringing new list if possible, not the best list everyone knows how to play against.

I don’t know how long your opponents have been playing (or using their armies) so my first comment is quite generic and more aimed at, if they are pretty new to the game. Although it’s fun to chop and change lists, using the same one with perhaps the odd tweak here and there over several games will mean they get to know the list inside out and although the list may become predictable if you are playing the same opponents repeatedly, will mean you also get much more proficient at using it.

I’ve had some reasonable success (and horrific defeats 😂) with my dwarves so it’s the one I feel I’m most able to comment on. As such I’ve put below a fairly standard dwarf all comers list (I don’t tailor). It’s pretty similar to what I have run as a more competitive list (though nowadays we tend to take more fluffy choices). We also tend to play 2500 and I like to field a single organ gun and a block of Irondrakes instead of a second organ gun. I think this it’s should have a good number of tools to deal with threats. I’ll talk through why I’ve taken options but your dwarf player may already know all of it. Again I don’t know how new or not to the game he or she may be so it’s not meant to be condescending if it covers obvious stuff.

There is an extensive dwarf tactica article in the tactics section of this forum that is well worth a read. It’s a compilation of many articles from across the web.

Characters
I tend to run all dwarf characters as support.
The two runesmiths provide each combat block with armour piercing and have dispel runes to assist against your magic. They are equipped as cheaply as possible with just a 2+ armour (and normal parry). The General will go in the hammerers and the other one in the Longbeards.

The BSB will also go in the Longbeards as he will give some extra punch with his GW. The rune of iron also helps his survivability due to the extra wound. Hammerers are rightly feared in combat and I’ve found most opponents try to avoid them, hence I tend to always put any combat characters in the weaker dwarf units.

The two engineers are there purely to buff the organ guns. They have a 3+ armour and the pistol gives them an additional attack (it helps when using them as bodyguards for the warmachines).

Troops
A couple of units of quarrellers are essential for chaff removal duty (looking at the dogs!). The range is what gives them the edge in that task over thunderers. I put GWs on them but shields are not a bad option either, especially as that synergies well with stand and shoot reactions, combined with them sitting either side of the hammerers unit to be in the stubborn bubble.

In the list below I put shieldbeards, as they get the runic banner so can also be given stubborn (and are also cheaper than GW longbeards). They also get immune to psych, an added bonus vs undead but not why I chose them. You could easily swop them for GW warriors as that would give more bodies in the unit. There is an article in the Dwarf tactica section that compares (mathshammers) our core choices.

The hammerers are just great. Everyone knows it. I love giving them the stubborn banner (even though they are stubborn already) as then they anchor the line, giving it to any other unit that can’t get it themselves (quarrellers).

Warmachines
The cannon is there to primarily take out things like the big items that would be in the rare slot or corpse cart.
The grudge thrower can be used for the same thing, though has more versatility and is good for hordes/bigger units (ghouls!).
The two organ guns are there for thinning out ranks. I’d use them first against anything that could threaten them (vargiests, black knights, dogs etc) before then turning their attention to ghouls. They’ll normally hit on a 2+ at short range and 3+ at long. Always re-roll a 2 on an artillery dice (unless the other one was a misfire of course!).
Your gyros are unit killers. March them up (dropping bombs as they move over the units into the backfield). Then just use them to steamgun the units repeatedly. Also use them to bait/redirect if needed. Don’t be afraid to also use them to charge it and try and character assassinate the necromancer (though I’d only do that if he was the only wizard left alive so force crumble tests).




Dwarf 2400
Dwarfs

Thane: Battle Standard; great weapon; Master Rune of Gromril; Rune of Iron 146

Runesmith: shield; Rune of Stone; Rune of Spellbreaking 93

Runesmith: (General); shield; Rune of Stone; Rune of Spellbreaking; Rune of the Furnace 98

Master Engineer: Dwarf pistol; Rune of Stone 81

Master Engineer: Dwarf pistol; Rune of Stone 81

10 Quarrellers: great weapons 140

10 Quarrellers: great weapons 140

23 Longbeards: Old Guard; musician; standard bearer (Rune of Stoicism); shields 364

Gyrocopter 80

Gyrocopter 80

Cannon: Rune of Forging 145

Grudge Thrower: Rune of Penetrating; Rune of Accuracy 145

29 Hammerers: Keeper of the Gate; musician; standard bearer (Master Rune of Groth One-Eye) 511

Organ Gun: Rune of Accuracy 145

Organ Gun: Rune of Accuracy; Rune of Burning 150

2,399 points

I mean this with 0 disrespect, because I'll also field strong armies vs my friends. But I do so against friends that are knowledgeable. So if the problem you state is true, and you always beat them and then you say "I field a blender lord" vs new players. Then.....

So I echo what Sedge said, stop bringing top tier lists vs newer players until they get the hang of it. Drop the blender lord in bus knight / GW Grave Guard, and try thematic lists, loreful lists, just for fun lists and have fun.

Again, I don't mean it in a mean way at all, but more so than changing their lists, which defnitely could help, I think you need to change yours.

We all just started with 8th edition in late October but I have 2 3D printers that we have been using to build armies since the cost of starting from scratch in warhammer is something that none of us were willing to do. Given how new it is and the amount of people that need things for their armies, it here are some limitations of models but since we are all friends/family, we have no issues with using proxy models and labeling a dry erase card directly behind the unit for what it is and how many there are (we’re never going to play in any official GW tournaments and is unlikely to play against anyone but each other so we aren’t too worried about being “official”). So given that, pretty much anything in the books are available to use. 

I also like the idea of doing a points handicap of -100 for each consecutive win. I think that will be good to try out. I do worry that it may give me an advantage in a campaign we are looking to start up soon where uneven battles will be quite common. Having that practice without anyone else getting the practice could be pretty valuable, but that may be a problem for another day. As of now, I just want to make sure that I don’t dissuade these guys from playing so I think this idea is still great. 

We have done 2v2 a couple times early on but not in the last 2 months. Are there different rules for triumph and treachery? We played it as a team of these 2 armies vs a team of those 2 armies. Side one went at the same time and shared power/dispel dice, then side 2 would go.

We did try changing armies with High Elves and VC (him and I have played the most games to this point) and it ended up being more frustrating for him because HE won by a very decisive margin and quite quickly as well. Everyone has access to digital files now of the BRB and each army book. I don’t look at other army books because I don’t want to have that be another thing that tips the scales my way, but I do read the brb often and have gotten pretty active reading on this forum (it’s all YOUR fault for giving me too much insight and strategy tips!!! j/k) so I know more of the nuances of the game (but they definitely have a good understanding of all the rules now too). I always give opportunities to go back to something if there was a misunderstanding or a niche rule that wasn’t known to be a thing and try to be more lenient to the players (ie. Go ahead this time but let’s double check after the game, then you see me post in the Rules board here for clarification).

We also play at my house so even when I’m not playing a game I am usually watching the game and seeing what is being used and how. This probably gives me even more of an advantage that the others aren’t benefiting from as well. In about 30 games since we started, I’ve been part of or witness to all of it except for maybe 3 turns. 

Lastly, we do have a discussion after the game about what happened and what a turning point was, though we don’t take pictures so maybe that would help. I’ve tried asking them after the game what their strategy/goal was and I share with them what mine was. I have faith that they will be kicking my ass soon, just hopeful to shorten the learning curve for them so it’s not too frustrating early on. Thanks for your input.

you sound like a reasonable man, it'll all work out.

maybe your friends/family need to spend more time on this forum to even the odds...

Long and short, blenderbus will beat newbies. We all know this. Drop it and play with softer units. Learn how to win with them instead. Or pretty shortly you'll be trying to figure out how to play WFB with no opponents.

Been there, done that, it isn't fun being the one who singlehandedly destroyed a WFB community by insisting on playing hard all the time.