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Post by Horace on Jan 29, 2021 15:46:39 GMT
I have a feeling this one was never resolved but can't remember which other model the argument was over.
This regards Bubebolos the Toad Dragon's breath attack, specifically when used in close combat.
It states:
"This is a breath weapon attack, and any model caught within it's template is automatically hit and must pass a Toughness test at -1 or suffer D3 wounds. No armour saves may be taken against this attack"
So when used in close combat, is that 2D6 Toughness tests, or still 1 Toughness test? It would seem to me to be 2D6 tests from the way the rulebook reads but I could well be mistaken.
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Post by FvonSigmaringen on Jan 29, 2021 17:21:47 GMT
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Post by Horace on Jan 29, 2021 19:38:16 GMT
Kind of argueing the other way in that thread 😂 Clear as mud then. So what would your take be on Zombie Dragon, Galrauch, Carmine Dragon & Bubebolos FvonSigmaringen ? How would you personally play each?
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Post by FvonSigmaringen on Jan 30, 2021 8:41:36 GMT
Still this: Prima facie, this would mean that a model needs to take only one test, regardless of the number of hits, although the wording is sufficiently vague to allow for a test for each hit. Hence, it seems best to discuss it with your opponent beforehand.
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Post by FvonSigmaringen on Jan 30, 2021 14:59:23 GMT
Not sure if this will be more conclusive, but let us actually integrate the relevant part of the BRB rule (Italics) in the special rule:
In close combat the Toad Dragon's breath attack inflicts 2D6 automatic hits on a single enemy unit in base contact — if there is more than one enemy unit in base contact with the model, the controlling player chooses which enemy unit suffers the hits. Any model hit must pass a Toughness test at -1 or suffer D3 wounds. No armour saves may be taken against this attack. Wounds caused by a Breath Weapon in close combat count towards combat resolution.
If anything, this strengthens the "single test" reading.
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Post by Horace on Jan 30, 2021 15:46:14 GMT
Not sure if this will be more conclusive, but let us actually integrate the relevant part of the BRB rule (Italics) in the special rule: In close combat the Toad Dragon's breath attack inflicts 2D6 automatic hits on a single enemy unit in base contact — if there is more than one enemy unit in base contact with the model, the controlling player chooses which enemy unit suffers the hits. Any model hit must pass a Toughness test at -1 or suffer D3 wounds. No armour saves may be taken against this attack. Wounds caused by a Breath Weapon in close combat count towards combat resolution.If anything, this strengthens the "single test" reading. How about the Carmine Dragon? Seems to me it would inflict 2d6 auto wounding d3 wound hits with no save. Which is ludicrous. I think we will play 1 test 1 hit but I'm not sure that's an accurate interpretation
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Post by FvonSigmaringen on Jan 30, 2021 16:00:58 GMT
The "single test" reading would apply to the Coruscating Blast too, as well as to any other breath weapon with similarly worded rules.
In close combat the Coruscating Blast breath attack inflicts 2D6 automatic hits on a single enemy unit in base contact — if there is more than one enemy unit in base contact with the model, the controlling player chooses which enemy unit suffers the hits. Any model hit suffers D3 wounds [with a strength equivalent to 10, minus the target’s Toughness score], with no Armour saves possible. Wounds caused by a Breath Weapon in close combat count towards combat resolution.
[]: Forgeworld variation of the rule.
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Post by DiscoQing on Feb 2, 2021 15:09:31 GMT
Doesn't the breath weapon cause 2D6 of those hits?
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Post by FvonSigmaringen on Feb 2, 2021 17:09:47 GMT
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Post by fantacap on Feb 3, 2021 9:32:06 GMT
Cant see why it wouldn't just be 2d6 toughness tests.. The whole unit isn't hit.
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Post by FvonSigmaringen on Feb 3, 2021 22:36:02 GMT
That is correct, but not the issue. 2D6 models hit will have to pass a Toughness test. Horace (as should become clear from the thread I have linked)is referring to either a challenge in CC, or a situation where the enemy unit in CC consists only of a single model.
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Post by wundapantz on Feb 4, 2021 6:14:08 GMT
Not sure if this will be more conclusive, but let us actually integrate the relevant part of the BRB rule (Italics) in the special rule: In close combat the Toad Dragon's breath attack inflicts 2D6 automatic hits on a single enemy unit in base contact — if there is more than one enemy unit in base contact with the model, the controlling player chooses which enemy unit suffers the hits. Any model hit must pass a Toughness test at -1 or suffer D3 wounds. No armour saves may be taken against this attack. Wounds caused by a Breath Weapon in close combat count towards combat resolution.If anything, this strengthens the "single test" reading. I'm not a scholar in the toad breath, but I read it like this Breath does 2d6 hits = 7 hits Count how many models hit = 7 in a unit or 1 in a challenge (2 if mounted on a monster etc) That number of models hit take a toughness test
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Post by strutsagget on Feb 4, 2021 7:06:37 GMT
I guess this would also apply if there is less models in the unit then the score of the dice.
For example if you use breath weapon on a unit of 5 skinks and roll 7 hits I cant find myself telling the opponent it should do 7 Toughness tests.
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Post by strutsagget on Feb 4, 2021 7:12:57 GMT
Isn’t there a rule that you only do 1 test per phase or is that specific for LD tests?
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Post by wundapantz on Feb 4, 2021 7:20:08 GMT
Just for panic. The fear rule says if next to 1 or more fear causing units... So it's the one test for all at the start of close combat (Terror triggers a panic test).
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