|
|
Post by vulcan on Oct 17, 2021 15:16:36 GMT
And in any sort of realistic battle a unit surrounded on four sides DIES... and yet, there are a lot of WFB units that will just thank you for the kills. In any sort of realistic battle if an elephant charges into your unit randomly either the unit gets out of the way - and is disrupted - or gets stepped on - and is disrupted. Doesn't work that way in WFB. In reality, cavalry charges, fights a bit, then pulls back and reorganizes for another charge. In WFB, not so much. Do not look to reality to explain WFB rules. That’s not necessarily true. A “breakout” of an “encirclement” is a real tactic. Although I’ll grant you it doesn’t work in Warhammer lol. You can’t elect to disengage from CC hah. Yes, but breaking out of an encirclement is a retreat. Killing everything surrounding you is a victory. |
|
|
|
Post by saniles on Oct 17, 2021 15:19:09 GMT
There’s reality then there’s taking the piss, if it’s a gobbo next to an A-Bomb, the A-Bomb is gonna chow down. And I would argue that a surrounded unit of Chaos Warriors beating all of their attackers, wiping out two of them and breaking the other two, running down and catching the biggest one is ALSO taking the piss. But it can and does happen in WFB. So let me caveat by stating I believe chaos warriors are stupidly overpowered in every way for their cost and that they are core. I agree, they are bullshit… I think context matters though. It really depends on what they are fighting, but I suspect you’ve had equally terrible fights against them as I have. I truly hate them. |
|
|
|
Post by saniles on Oct 17, 2021 15:19:40 GMT
That’s not necessarily true. A “breakout” of an “encirclement” is a real tactic. Although I’ll grant you it doesn’t work in Warhammer lol. You can’t elect to disengage from CC hah. Yes, but breaking out of an encirclement is a retreat. Killing everything surrounding you is a victory. No doubt. My only argument was that encirclement doesn’t always equal death. |
|
|
|
Post by thegoat on Oct 17, 2021 15:32:56 GMT
There’s reality then there’s taking the piss, if it’s a gobbo next to an A-Bomb, the A-Bomb is gonna chow down. And I would argue that a surrounded unit of Chaos Warriors beating all of their attackers, wiping out two of them and breaking the other two, running down and catching the biggest one is ALSO taking the piss. But it can and does happen in WFB. Under/over-costed units disrupting game balance (and enjoyment) has been an ever present issue with GW games. Fielding a deathstar unit combo can be just as unsportsmanlike as the railroading tactic. But maybe not quite "cheating". That said the Chosen Chaos Warriors + two Chaos Shrines BS that gives them a 3+ ward save (or however it worked) is cheating of the beardiest kind. Back in the day the rules for named special characters (Karl Franz, Grimgor Ironhide, etc.) actually required you to get your opponent's permission before you could use them in your army list. That was recognizing that putting such a powerful character/unit on the table can seriously impact the other player's enjoyment of the game. That definitely influenced how I view fair sportsmanship in these games. |
|
|
|
Post by vulcan on Oct 17, 2021 15:44:15 GMT
Yes, but breaking out of an encirclement is a retreat. Killing everything surrounding you is a victory. No doubt. My only argument was that encirclement doesn’t always equal death. Usually the survivors that break out of an encirclement are only a small portion of what was encircled, and their unit cohesion is shot. So for WFB purposes, the unit is destroyed. |
|
|
|
Post by vulcan on Oct 17, 2021 15:48:19 GMT
I hate railroading. I’d prefer a home rule where by if the unit could beat the other unit one on one, pivoting counts as charging. As if a bloody A-Bomb is going to give 2 shits and one flying pluck about a Goblin on a Wolf.. HE WOULD EAT IT FFS! 🤦🏻♂️ Thinking about it... is that all that much better? You pivot and eat the cheap goblin character on your turn. Next turn I put another one there, pinning your A-bomb down again. Your turn you pivot and eat that one. Wash, rinse, repeat. I'm not sure how much a nearly-naked goblin boss on wolf costs, but if I can pin the A-bomb for two or three turns while surrendering less than it's cost in cheap characters I still call that a win. |
|
|
|
Post by FvonSigmaringen on Oct 17, 2021 15:59:22 GMT
vulcan: You cannot look at the situation in isolation: there are other factors that affect further turns (charge/shoot/magic possible blockers). Besides, after the first turn, the A-Bomb may already be headed for where it wants to be, and you would be trying to railroad it to its target.
|
|
|
|
Post by vulcan on Oct 18, 2021 3:46:36 GMT
vulcan : You cannot look at the situation in isolation: there are other factors that affect further turns (charge/shoot/magic possible blockers). Besides, after the first turn, the A-Bomb may already be headed for where it wants to be, and you would be trying to railroad it to its target. Yep. At which point railroading becomes irrelevant. |
|
