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Post by grandmasterwang on Apr 22, 2017 13:47:50 GMT
With regards to players dropping off in 8th and not returning.... unfortunately 8th Edition (my favourite of the 5 Warhammer editions I have had exposure to) was accompanied by some of the most ridiculous, brutal and non-sensical price rises from GW which was a huge deterrent to any player or potential player with less wealth than an Arab sheik!
In my country the hardback OnG armybook came out at an expensive but tolerable (barely) $55.... by the time the elf books were released GW had increased the price of this very same book to $83.........
Prices aside 8th featured some of my favourite ever miniature releases (all Warhammer editions had their release gems) such as the mighty Necrosphinx and Ghorgon kits.
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Post by dannytee on Apr 22, 2017 14:19:11 GMT
- Fear in editions other than 8th was totally crazy, if you lost combat to a fear causer, and you were outnumbered, you broke auto! In fact, psychology in general was too much. Low leadership stuff was extremely fragile - and you could not reroll with the BSB. - 6/7th edition the player could build their lists to determine how many magic dice they could get each phase. 8th might have some big spells, but the Winds of Magic are random, and armies are suppose to be larger. If you want to dominate your enemies with magic, play 6th and 7th edition, you can have your mighty magic phase every turn and crush your opponent without getting into combat! - Speaking of magic, if you played Vampire Counts and also had half a brain, you might lose to bad luck about once everyone ten games. With the power of magic, fear, and raise the dead, Undead armies were all but unbeatable. Yes, agree with these strongly. In 6th and 7th both one of my regular opponents was VC and I could never ever beat him. He had a ridiculous number of power dice so could raise his skeleton units up to huge numbers. Then in combat if he won by 1 I would auto break and was done for.
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Post by grandmasterwang on Apr 22, 2017 18:05:28 GMT
The worst part about autobrake for 6th and 7th was how it made a mockery of the dwarves legendary iron resolve. With Vanhels and a vampire up front a unit of zombies would almost certainly get the charge and probably win combat vs a dwarf combat block (no stepup back then).
With zombies being so cheap they would almost certainly outnumber the dwarves and voila... running dwarves... no test, no nothing....just dwarves running from zombies.....
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Post by Anaris on Apr 22, 2017 18:20:10 GMT
I don't have anything to compare it to, but I agree that 8th edition magic is balanced over all. Some games it doesn't seem so. Other games one person's magic phases go great and someone else's bombs.
Like in my high elf vs skaven game. He successfully cast and I couldn't dispel it, plague on my sword masters which he killed 10 out of 24 models. Well he rolled a 1 to see if it continues and a 1 says I can target any unit within 12" and I chose them and killed 18 out of 35 I believe or something. Anyways he rolled a 1 a second time to see if it continues and I could have targeted an additional unit, but I chose to just end the spell because I felt bad I did more casualties to himself.
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Post by Bureaucrat of Chaos on Apr 22, 2017 22:03:01 GMT
Noooo! You should have punished him! I love those kinds of effects in Warhammer.
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Post by Baronthehumbled on Apr 24, 2017 9:41:40 GMT
The only thing stopping me from playing AoS is LoS. I HATE 360° LoS as I enjoy flanking and movement shenanigans, and 40k and AoS take this away. If I wanted to play a fantasy skirmish game (I like them, and do play them) then I would play Warmachine or Hordes. Fair enough on the skirmish game comment but I feel a need to point out that AoS involves alot of movement for objectives and maneuvering charge angles as well as flanking for premium wound allocation that let's you hurt him more than he hurts you. This is a nice view on it if that's of any interest. www.warhammer-community.com/2017/02/14/tactical-toolbox-charging/The only thing stopping me from playing AoS is LoS. I HATE 360° LoS as I enjoy flanking and movement shenanigans, and 40k and AoS take this away. If I wanted to play a fantasy skirmish game (I like them, and do play them) then I would play Warmachine or Hordes. It's also stupid you can shoot your range weapons while in close combat and then still attack in close combat. Effectively making any shooting the best. Yeah high elf shadow warriors and sisters of avelorn for the win! Unless you have multiple attacks you can only do one of those things. Even then, shooters are horribly squishy and the ranges are shorter than 8th's.
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Post by gjnoronh on Apr 24, 2017 17:24:36 GMT
Gary, I am not arguing that people didn't quit after 8th was released, I was staying that the reason most people here are EEFL people is because AoS doesn't even resemble the old Warhammer. I've played 3rd edition, my friend had it, and agree that 8th isn't the same, but it had the same scope and feel that you can't get from a skirmish game. I also feel that you unfairly portray the EEFL community saying that they won't try other things. I've played and liked both KoW and AoS, although I feel like they are rules better fit for tournament play in a lot of ways. I think the fact that many tournament people left when 8th was released is due to the fact that it was not really well designed for tournament play. Many of us play many games, and EEFL stand for the idea that Eighth Edition Fantasy is the last of the Warhammer line in our eyes. I agree we are a diverse group on this forum. But there clearly is some AoS hate to be found as well as some love of 8th. Personally I think you can like both and it's not a one or the other situation. See this thread for some of the hate. Please note I'm not coming down on the folks who are AoS "hating" - just saying I don't take that thread and I think it's limiting some from appreciating what AoS does bring to the table. eefl.freeforums.net/thread/447/little-mad-moment
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Post by frozenfood on Apr 24, 2017 17:46:39 GMT
I hate the fact that there is no more new warhammer. I do not hate aos. The thread above is amusing but not very aos-friendly, I'll give you that 🙂
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Post by avatarofbugman on Apr 24, 2017 18:06:59 GMT
Gary, I am not arguing that people didn't quit after 8th was released, I was staying that the reason most people here are EEFL people is because AoS doesn't even resemble the old Warhammer. I've played 3rd edition, my friend had it, and agree that 8th isn't the same, but it had the same scope and feel that you can't get from a skirmish game. I also feel that you unfairly portray the EEFL community saying that they won't try other things. I've played and liked both KoW and AoS, although I feel like they are rules better fit for tournament play in a lot of ways. I think the fact that many tournament people left when 8th was released is due to the fact that it was not really well designed for tournament play. Many of us play many games, and EEFL stand for the idea that Eighth Edition Fantasy is the last of the Warhammer line in our eyes. I agree we are a diverse group on this forum. But there clearly is some AoS hate to be found as well as some love of 8th. Personally I think you can like both and it's not a one or the other situation. See this thread for some of the hate. Please note I'm not coming down on the folks who are AoS "hating" - just saying I don't take that thread and I think it's limiting some from appreciating what AoS does bring to the table. eefl.freeforums.net/thread/447/little-mad-momentThis thread is too much complaining for me. Too many people feel that their game is the only game.
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Post by wilsonthenarc on Apr 24, 2017 18:52:55 GMT
Just one man's opinion - Here is why I gripe about Age of Sigmar. Back in the day; I had to re-base 100 Chaos Marauders on foot. I think this was part of the move from 7th edition to 8th edition. Take 'em all off 20xx x 20mm squares. Put 'em all back on 25mm x 25mm squares. As part of that effort, I made a solemn oath. I would never re-base any army mass scale ever again.Honestly, I never even want to re-base a unit of more than 2 minis again just for new bases. There was a tournament. I was playing WoC. Someone pointed out that my Dragon Ogres were (incorrectly) on 40mm x 40mm square bases. They should be on 50mm x 75mm bases and that difference would make a ton of difference in combat. So I says to Mabel, I says: "But those are the bases I got when I bought them. They're totally legit. If you want to play that they have a theoretical length of 75mm and you get an extra attack from the flank, y'now, whatever... cool." But it was a test, and if my opponent said YES I'll take those extra attacks I would not have given him a bottle of beer. Luckily, he said Let's do whatever the models on the table are and we drank like Vikings that night. I think I also bought him a slice of 'Za circa 9:30 PM that night. And the moral of the story is: I ain't rebasing. I still have a critical mass of square base stuff still to paint. Once those are all painted to a Golden Demon Level and flocked and movement trays are complete and all minis are magnetized to matching movement trays and all characters have interchangeable weapon options via magnetized hands & arms and all of my armies have custom sculpted squishy foam transportation cases and 3 pieces of custom themed scenery per army, well, once all of that is done I will buy me some AoS stuff and play a few more games. And I will hang a framed picture of the entire family of black plastic round bases above my nightstand.
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Post by gjnoronh on Apr 24, 2017 19:30:53 GMT
Love it Will!
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Post by mahbruck on Apr 24, 2017 20:00:03 GMT
Same here. I have no problem playing Age of Sigmar but No fecking way will I rebase my models. ...well, unless GW can guarantee all my next AoS opponents are Victoria's Secret supramodels who will gladly have sex with me after the game (I will generously pay for some cheap wine though).
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Post by wilsonthenarc on Apr 24, 2017 20:07:55 GMT
SECRETS. Anyone remember this bit? conanobrien.wikia.com/wiki/Celebrity_SecretsSecrets: I have 100+ Wood Elfs. Archers, WayWatchers, Wardancers, Glade Riders, etc. I stripped the paint off my Wood Elf army last fall. I didn't put them on new bases yet because I might (just might) be convinced to put them on round bases so that I have one AoS playable army. SECRETS.
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Post by wilsonthenarc on Apr 24, 2017 20:09:07 GMT
I 'fessed up. Now all my EEFL friends are going to ostracize me and throw rotten fish at me when they see me walking down the street.
But the joke is on them... Secrets: I love the smell of rotten fish.
SECRETS.
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Post by gjnoronh on Apr 24, 2017 20:18:10 GMT
FWIW my ungors have moved from 20mm to 25 mm to 20mm squares between 5th/6th/7th ed books. Blood nuisance. AoS can play with squares reasonably you do have to make some counts as decisions on base sizes (otherwise chaos warriors for example attack in two ranks when their 32 mm round bases would normally prevent this.) I'm debating using magnetized 32 mm rounds under my magnetized 25 mm squares to have some flexibility from system to system.
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