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Post by mottdon on Aug 31, 2015 19:32:00 GMT
Maybe I'm way off target here, but it seems to me that the traffic on all of the Warhammer forums is way down. I'm not seeing nearly as many replies, new topics or projects posted as I once did. It even seems like activity on here has slowed somewhat. Why is that? Do you sense the same thing? Is it because so many older gamers are getting out of the hobby and newer gamers just don't visit the forums? Please discuss. I'd really like to know everyone else's impressions.
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Post by phierlihy on Aug 31, 2015 22:42:05 GMT
Not only that but youtube batreps have all but disappeared as well. It's not just you - it's the flux we've been thrown into after GW flipped their middle finger at us. Things will get sorted out slowly while some folks try to keep playing 8th edition, the 9th age is constructed, some will check out AoS and then wander back to Warhammer, and so on. This is definitely a low point and I expect it to continue for a few more months yet. I, on the other hand, have been motivated to actually finish painting some models and start putting out 8th/9th edition bat reps so players know the game is not dead!
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Post by mottdon on Aug 31, 2015 23:33:19 GMT
The batreps sound like a good thing! Please post links so that we can be sure to catch them and support 8th!
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Post by dannytee on Aug 31, 2015 23:59:46 GMT
I am certain that there are people who simply gave up warhammer when AoS came out. I went to a tournament about one week after AoS was released. The tournament was 8th edition and initially had 60'ish people sign up and pay but only 40'ish showed up. Some of these "rage quit" and told the tournament organizer that they were done playing warhammer in any form. It personally doesn't make sense to me.
There is another tournament in my area every November. In the past there have been 70'ish players to show up for fantasy. This year they are running both AoS and 8th edition with a total of 60 spots split between the two depending on the demand for each game. I haven't yet heard what the demand is in terms of which game will fill more spots or if they will even fill the 60 spots.
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Post by mottdon on Sept 1, 2015 1:47:59 GMT
Geez. I kinda figured but we only have one major tournament around here and I'm not even sure they will be continuing it. Most of the people in that core group rage quit GW altogether too. I guess we'll see how it goes, but I know the local GW store manager is really scared they are going to close down his store because he said that nobody is coming in to buy AoS stuff. There are only about 4 people who play. I just go in to get paints. I feel bad for him, he's a nice guy, but nobody can hold a grudge like a southerner. We must have Dwarf blood in us somewhere.
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Post by phierlihy on Sept 1, 2015 1:56:07 GMT
Two weeks ago I went to a 24 person tournament and everyone had an amazing time. Warhammer Fantasy sure isn't dead in my area.
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Post by avatarofbugman on Sept 1, 2015 3:03:10 GMT
Some of the major contributors here, like myself, are teachers. I've been doing more school prep than even sleeping recently. Also there are parents as well. All forums have some ebb and flow. The home brewing forum I'm on gets real quiet in February.
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Post by KevinC on Sept 1, 2015 3:08:54 GMT
I personally don't understand it.
For some reason, many players can LOVE a particular game, but if the company goes out of business or the game itself is no longer supported, these same lovers of the game no longer want to play.
Why?
With absolutely no harm meant to any gamer out there, I'm really not concerned it GW supports WFB (of course, I'd prefer if they did). I own all the rulebooks and army books, I own more models than I will ever be able to paint in this lifetime and I know many people that still want to play this game (though that number has declined dramatically). So what does GW have to do with anything? "Rage quit" I will never understand, it raises the question – were you ever truly a Warhammer player to begin with?
Getting back to the initial question, forums have been on the downhill for sometime. This is partly due to social networks like Facebook and Twitter, but also to the past year of the End Times where people knew a new version of Warhammer was coming.
I know exactly where GW messed up though. They claim they are a miniatures company, and that selling miniatures are their main thing. I would ask them: is this really true? Because if you want to sell miniatures, I have a brilliant idea, and I stole from GW too. GW made a great move by producing Daemon armies where the models could be used in both WFB and 40K. As far as I understand – it worked. Daemons sold, and continue to sell, well.
They could have done that again on a larger scale. The entire WFB range could have been used in TWO games – WFB AND AOS. Why does GW care what game we are playing as long as we are buying their models? Even if they limited the support to WFB, it would still work. And explaining this concept to new players would be no hassle, you already have to explain the difference between AOS and 40K. Telling the newbie you can use this huge range of models in two different games, in two entirely different ways, is a good selling point, is it not?
Anyway, I don't think players should be so upset. The best this to do is focus on your hobby, how you like it.
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Post by phierlihy on Sept 1, 2015 4:10:22 GMT
Actually I don't think that would work so well. From what I gather from the Internetz (which is why it's OBVIOUSLY true...) is that Fantasy just wasn't selling. It cost so much to get into the game, there just wasn't enough new blood coming in unlike 40K where new players join all the time. Fantasy players are all pretty stocked as far as minis go. I don't need any more minis and I don't think most others do either. They needed to kill the existing line and generate a new one. However where *I* think GW went wrong was so bluntly saying "screw you!" to their player base. I don't think they understood just how frustrated their player base already was and a LOT of people were more than willing to just walk away; a fact GW should have understood before they screwed fantasy. I love Warhammer but there are plenty of companies out there. If I want something new, you can be darn sure I won't give my $$$ to GW. And I don't think I'm alone in that.
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Post by Anton on Sept 1, 2015 5:48:39 GMT
Forum activity is down on the army specific forums I visit. It isn't down on the more general forums like TWF or our local tournament-oriented one where 9th Age is the big thing right now with so many Swedes involved.
I agree with Kevin though, they could have kept 8th edition alive alongside AoS. It would have cost them next to nothing. Besides, there are places where WFB was actually selling well. The two GW stores in Sweden have consistently sold as much Fantasy as 40k and they are among the most profitable stores in Europe. Obviously these stores are exceptions or we wouldn't be where we are now, but there is a market, and with AoS fixing the high entry cost problem it would have been ideal to have a bigger game for people to 'level up' to.
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Post by mottdon on Sept 1, 2015 15:59:35 GMT
I agree with Kevin as well. There was no reason why they couldn't keep 8th edition and AoS. They should have made a few minor tweaks to 8th (thus bringing it to 9th) and introduced AoS as the new "skirmish" game or simply a different way of playing. That would have been a double-win for them. Getting new players started collecting models, and eventually amassing large scale armies. AoS should have been a gateway drug. New armies and even new IP's could have been introduced to both. It wouldn't take much of a fluff change. The batreps seem to have all dried up because the big producers want to have a game that is constantly having new releases coming out to support their videos and keep them fresh, while the ones who really don't care about all of that seem to have all of the wind taken out of their sails. I don't buy into this whole notion of older players don't buy anything either. I have 7 very large armies, and I still buy more than anybody near me. I want everything. That keeps me buying. When I see Anton's huge hordes of Night Goblins (hundreds strong), I want that. I work toward that. I've seen so many people online who's armies dwarf anything that I have. When I see these HUGE dioramas of thousands of Orcs & Goblins storming a castle, I absolutely drool. That kind of imagery fuels my desire for more and more, which is why I don't think that these old veteran players are just sitting at home on their stockpile of figures, waiting for a game to happen. I think they are the most involved people in the game and the most consistent buyers of miniatures. "Little Timmy" getting a new boxed set for Christmas or his birthday isn't keeping the product afloat. Most of all, I blame poor marketing. If GW had pushed Fantasy as much as they did 40K, then I believe that they would have seen big differences in their profit margins. If they put the effort into getting the game out there in front of the players and held tournaments, sales, promotional events, etc. then the line would have done much better than it has done. If they wanted to take it even further, they should have lowered the prices just a bit and made it equal across the entire product line. (For example, 5 Squig Herd models should never cost $25. Especially when you've written the rules so that a player needs around 30 of them to truly be able to use them.) While I do believe that most people who "rage quit" will be back, I also think that the gaming atmosphere will have irreparably changed. It will have to be player driven from now on whereas before, there was a certain degree of reliance upon GW to force feed us our game. It will have to become something totally new and separate from GW or any other formal standard. "These are our rules. Come and play if you want." Over time we'll see a common theme develop and companies will step up to fill the gap GW has vacated. That's when we'll see a huge upswing in forum participation. In the meantime, it'll be up to those of us who are loyal to the community and game to keep it moving ahead. RALLY, BROTHERS! RALLY!  |
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Post by TheREALricksalamone on Sept 1, 2015 21:51:12 GMT
Ok, I've got something to say regarding the local tournament (Daboyz) that was mentioned earlier. I swore off tourney play a few years ago. As my friends know it's just not my thing. I go there for the hobby aspect and even that has become a frustration. Now to my point: If we are all about EEFL, if we live this game and want to show the gaming community that we are still here, we need to put our money where our mouths are. We need to descend on this event in full force and represent. Imagine if we blow off the event and they have maybe 12 players show up for EE and like 40 guys come for aos. Obviously I don't know the true numbers but it would be tragic, especially during these perilous times, to have it appear that nobody cares about warhammer fantasy anymore. Who's in?!?!
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Post by wilsonthenarc on Sept 1, 2015 22:35:53 GMT
I paid for DaBoys yesterday, Wilson is 100% in, son.
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Post by roughtimes on Sept 1, 2015 22:50:46 GMT
I personally don't understand it. For some reason, many players can LOVE a particular game, but if the company goes out of business or the game itself is no longer supported, these same lovers of the game no longer want to play. Why? With absolutely no harm meant to any gamer out there, I'm really not concerned it GW supports WFB (of course, I'd prefer if they did). I own all the rulebooks and army books, I own more models than I will ever be able to paint in this lifetime and I know many people that still want to play this game (though that number has declined dramatically). So what does GW have to do with anything? "Rage quit" I will never understand, it raises the question – were you ever truly a Warhammer player to begin with? Getting back to the initial question, forums have been on the downhill for sometime. This is partly due to social networks like Facebook and Twitter, but also to the past year of the End Times where people knew a new version of Warhammer was coming. I know exactly where GW messed up though. They claim they are a miniatures company, and that selling miniatures are their main thing. I would ask them: is this really true? Because if you want to sell miniatures, I have a brilliant idea, and I stole from GW too. GW made a great move by producing Daemon armies where the models could be used in both WFB and 40K. As far as I understand – it worked. Daemons sold, and continue to sell, well. They could have done that again on a larger scale. The entire WFB range could have been used in TWO games – WFB AND AOS. Why does GW care what game we are playing as long as we are buying their models? Even if they limited the support to WFB, it would still work. And explaining this concept to new players would be no hassle, you already have to explain the difference between AOS and 40K. Telling the newbie you can use this huge range of models in two different games, in two entirely different ways, is a good selling point, is it not? Anyway, I don't think players should be so upset. The best this to do is focus on your hobby, how you like it. It is odd. I don't really fully understand the reasoning behind quitting WH just because GW is out of the picture. The garage hammer guy cited this as one of the reasons for moving to AOS. There are so many different armies right now with almost too many options. There wasn't even much left for GW to add. Just look at some of the most recent additions. I think the real issue is the lack of creativity of many current players. They are totally dependent on GW for rules and fluff. Write your own fluff. Create a new unit or character or magic item for your army. Don't wait for GW to force feed you. It's nice to see forums like this embrace the creative side of the hobby. |
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Post by roughtimes on Sept 1, 2015 22:53:33 GMT
Ok, I've got something to say regarding the local tournament (Daboyz) that was mentioned earlier. I swore off tourney play a few years ago. As my friends know it's just not my thing. I go there for the hobby aspect and even that has become a frustration. Now to my point: If we are all about EEFL, if we live this game and want to show the gaming community that we are still here, we need to put our money where our mouths are. We need to descend on this event in full force and represent. Imagine if we blow off the event and they have maybe 12 players show up for EE and like 40 guys come for aos. Obviously I don't know the true numbers but it would be tragic, especially during these perilous times, to have it appear that nobody cares about warhammer fantasy anymore. Who's in?!?! I'm thinking about it but the $80 fee sorta sucks. i may just try for the doubles event. |
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