|
|
Post by quenelles84 on Jan 24, 2023 18:32:33 GMT
Couple of issues from last night’s game, welcome your thoughts
So a unit of knights + a lord (on his own) and some grails are all in combat with a few skeletons + Tomb Prince (one unit).
The unit of knights is then flank charged by a unit of Tomb Guard with a Tomb King. This means only the knights are in base contact with both units (with Lord and Grails only touching Skeleton unit).
Q1: If my lord declares a challenge can either the the Tomb Prince or the Tomb King accept? (we thought not the king as couldn’t move to the Lord?)
Q2: Assuming in example below the prince does accept the challenge and the Lord does kills him and that this means he is now out of base contact with anyone (as he only had partial contact with Prince) Is the Lord still in combat? (even though the Grails didn’t kill the skeletons). I think not, and so this single combat now becomes 2 separate combats?)
Thanks for your thoughts as ever.
P S S
T E E E L G G G
T E E E
K E E E
T
T
T
S = Skeletons
P = Tomb Prince
T = Tomb Guard
K = Tomb King
E = Bret Knights Errant
L = Bret Lord
G = Bret Grails
|
|
|
|
Post by DiscoQing on Jan 24, 2023 19:47:57 GMT
When you issue a Challenge;
Any character able to accept, must be in the unit in base contact with the Challenger/their unit.
You don't have to be in base contact to fight a challenge - but if you can, move in to base contact.
|
|
|
|
Post by quenelles84 on Jan 24, 2023 20:50:38 GMT
Thanks - so in example only the prince could accept (Not the king) which is how we played it 👍
|
|
|
|
Post by FvonSigmaringen on Jan 25, 2023 10:45:07 GMT
Q1: What DiscoQing says. BRB p. 102: "If your opponent has issued a challenge, you can now accept it with one of your characters or champions whose unit is in base contact with the unit containing the issuer of the challenge. Note that a character does not have to be in base contact with an enemy to accept or issue a challenge, just part of a unit that is." Q2: If possible, you would nudge either the Lord or the Skeletons into base contact, as long as all models that are in CC remain in CC. If that is not possible, the "no More Foes" rule applies. BRB p. 61 (Shrinking Units and Multiple Fights): "Occasionally, a situation can arise when one or more units are no longer in base contact with the enemy, but at least part of the enemy unit is still alive. [...] Whenever a unit becomes stranded in this manner, the attacking unit is immediately nudged (by as small an amount as possible) to bring it back into contact with the foe. This move cannot be used to alter the facing the attacker is in base contact with, nor is it an opportunity to change the attacker's formation or charge a unit not engaged in the fight. If the attacker cannot be moved in this manner, then the defending unit is moved instead." BRB p. 61 (No More Foes): "In multiple combats it can sometimes happen that at the end of a round of close combat some units are no longer engaged with any enemy unit (normally because the unit they were engaged with has been completely destroyed). Such units are out of combat for all purposes and can move normally from then on. Any combat result points that unit would have added to the fight for wounds inflicted are still counted for the fight's overall combat resolution, but other bonuses, such as standards, charges and so on. are not. Note that such a unit cannot cancel out steadfast in an enemy." |
|
|
|
Post by quenelles84 on Jan 25, 2023 19:55:46 GMT
That makes sense. we rolled for it and the lord was released, but from above I’d say we should actually have nudged the skeletons and so kept him in combat.
Thanks!
|
|
|
|
Post by wundapantz on Jan 26, 2023 4:25:28 GMT
Bonus example... For academics only...
I played a game that had a goblin shaman and a goblin warlord on opposite ends of a goblin horde (eg, file 1 and file 10) and were combo charged by two units.
Due to allocation of attacks, the only surviving members were the two characters, now in base to base with two separate units.
We played it as two separate combats, and both characters took individual break tests (both needed Insane Bravery to stay, and both failed).
Was it played right, or only after the combat has been resolved (one break test and flee roll, but a chance each to pursue from the 2 units)?
|
|
|
|
Post by FvonSigmaringen on Jan 26, 2023 10:22:47 GMT
BRB Official Update Version 1.9, p.11:
Q: At what point after a unit has been wiped out do any characters remaining count as having left the unit? (p101)
A: As soon as the last model from the unit has been removed, any remaining characters will count as a new unit. Note that this will cause Panic tests to all friendly units within 6” (including the newly formed unit of character(s)) as the unit has been destroyed.
That still leaves some questions open, e.g. since they are new units, do they still have to take the Break test?
|
|
|
|
Post by thegoat on Feb 1, 2023 18:28:43 GMT
BRB Official Update Version 1.9, p.11: Q: At what point after a unit has been wiped out do any characters remaining count as having left the unit? (p101) A: As soon as the last model from the unit has been removed, any remaining characters will count as a new unit. Note that this will cause Panic tests to all friendly units within 6” (including the newly formed unit of character(s)) as the unit has been destroyed. That still leaves some questions open, e.g. since they are new units, do they still have to take the Break test? They are a new unit. But the models in the unit were involved in the combat. So, I say, if they lost combat, they have to take a break test with the proper modifiers. |
|
|
|
Post by FvonSigmaringen on Feb 2, 2023 10:55:48 GMT
thegoat: Perhaps, perhaps not. It is not clear from the FAQ. Units, not models, take Break tests, and the new unit has not lost combat. Something similar occurs with fleeing. Imagine a fleeing unit with less than 25% left, where then all the R&F are killed, e.g. because of DT tests, and only a character remains, becoming a new unit. Does he now take a Panic test, or does he continue to flee? If the latter, he certainly would not need double ones to rally, since, as a new unit, it would be at 100%. Such questions are fairly obvious, and could/should have been addressed immediately.
|
|
|
|
Post by thegoat on Feb 2, 2023 12:03:58 GMT
FvonSigmaringen For sure, I agree it is ambiguous in the rules. My reply was meant to be how I think it should be played; how I would play it if it came up in a game.
|
|
