Salamander Hunting Pack + Monster and handlers.

A Salamander Hunting Pack is made up of 1+ packs, with each pack consisting of 1 Salamander and 3 Skink Handlers. Hence, the unit needs to take a Monster Reaction test, each time the handlers of a pack are removed. The Monster Reaction test results will apply to all the remaining beasts, but do not stack, because it is not specified they do. Indeed, they simply cannot stack, because Grrrrr is incompatible with the other two.

Lizardmen AB p. 46: "If the unit needs to take a Monster Reaction test, the result applies to all remaining monstrous beasts."

Looking across the rules in both Lizardmen and BRB for both 7th and 8th, the wording of the combination of rules seems pretty consistent regarding when a Monster Reaction test should be taken. The idea that a unit (on 8th) can be made of multiple Hunting Packs doesn’t take away from the idea that it is still a single unit. As such I would only test on the Monster Reaction chart once all handlers (in the unit) are removed. This means you wouldn’t need to keep track of each Salamander’s handlers differently.

On another note, it seems that when shooting at a Monster and Handlers, you distribute wounds (handlers on a 5+), however, with ridden monsters you distribute hits.

I’d be interested to hear how others play this.

How do you make out which handlers can strike? In my above example 2 of the 5 salamanders were not in base contact with the enemy therefore not all handlers could hit back based on the monster and handler rules. The handlers can strike what is in base contact with there monster. So you kind of have to keep track which skink belongs to which salamander. For our game we just spread the handlers evenly for simplicity.

I’ll try to explain my reasoning.
Firstly, BRB pg 73
“… we ignore them [the handlers]…treating the monster itself as the extent of the unit.”

Lizardmen 8th Pg 94
“Salamander Hunting Pack
Unit size: 1+ packs”

Would these to points together make ‘1+ Salamander Hunting Packs’ the unit, and thus the equivalent of a monster in the M&H rules? If correct, you can insert Salamander Unit into the wording to replace Monster.
If nothing else it does demonstrate the difficulty of applying M&H rules to a unit of monstrous beasts, ie. what counts as the unit. Can you have a unit of units?

The other point was about the exemption in the 6/7th Lizardmen book which, to me, reads very similar to the Brb core rules:

BRB 8th pg 73:
“Once all the handlers have been removed, the monster must take a Monster Reaction test…”

Lizardmen 7th pg 56 “…if all the Skink Handlers are slain, then the remaining Salamanders must take a…[MRt]”

One final point is that the Lizardmen rules make no mention of how to deal with wounds caused by ranged attacks. If each salamander’s handlers needed to be tracked separately, surely the Lizardmen rules would state something about the requirement to randomise hits amongst salamanders within the unit before determining whether salamander or handler is hit.

Therefore, In close combat you would have up to 3 skink attacks for each salamander in base contact.

I have no answer for the Spanish wording of the rule; which version would be less likely to have errors? If the French and German rules follow the Spanish version then I’d suspect that’s pretty good evidence (if anyone has a copy?).

Let me know what you think!

In close combat do you still randomise wounds between the salamander and handlers?
How do you assign wounds (shooting or CC) to the salamander handlers?

Thanks, Fidelis, I think I get it now. It behaves like a unit of individual monsters (only they don’t get a thunderstomp). Each one is its own separate entity like a unit of characters would be. In fact, just seeing it from this perspective it all makes sense. Randomise which salamander is hit when shooting missile weapons, then roll to wound and then see whether salamander or handler are hit. In close combat, you need to nominate which salamander you are directing attacks at.
if you happen to kill the handlers of a particular salamander before the salamander, itself, gets killed (in the same initiative step) then roll for a monster reaction test.