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Post by livewaaaaagh on Jan 14, 2019 22:00:05 GMT
Hi all,
We continue the "Most Feared Unit" series and today we tackle Elves for the first time, but of course not Dark or High Elves because.. no! Instead, today we focus on the Asrai, the tree people, the hippies, the tree huggers, the annoying army that never engages and dances around you till you die or boredom or arrows. Yes, that one!
There are many fearsome units in the roster: from the mighty Treemen to Wildriders to Waywatchers, to Glade Guard who shoot with no modifiers! There are several ways of fielding a scary Wood Elf army. What is your way? And what unit do you fear most when facing the Wood Elves?
Discuss!
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Post by mottdon on Jan 15, 2019 13:40:01 GMT
THESE GUYS!
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Post by mottdon on Jan 15, 2019 14:08:57 GMT
No, in all honesty, I think one of the most feared units (for me at least) would have to be multiple units of Wild Riders. They are definitely a glass cannon, but can hit like a ton of rocks! They're also very hard to catch and can jump around the board to threaten your backfield fairly quickly. Back them up with a Glad Captain on Great Stag (or Great Eagle), and you have a force that you can't ignore.
I don't know that there is really any ONE unit that I'd say is overly scary since practically all of the army is extremely squishy or has built-in weaknesses (like Flammable). Treekin could be be pretty nasty, but seem to fall just short on the "OH CRAP"-O-Meter. Wardancers and Wildwood Rangers are about the same in that they need to be able to hit quickly and decisively. Waywatchers work better on paper than on the table top, IMO. They either get pushed to an outside flank where they have to fight for position to stay relevant, or you have to devote way too many units to defending them, and in a very squishy army, that's usually not a good idea.
IMO, Wood Elves are, and should be, played as a "hit and run" army. Stack your ranks with fast, mobile units that can threaten weak points in your opponent's defenses, and let your superior ranged units pour on the pressure from afar. Add in a few ambushing units (like Glade Riders), excellent redirectors (like Great Eagles) and other tricks in the WE arsenal, and you have a potentially NASTY army. But they all need to work in tandem.
FYI - One of my favorite builds (if I'm feeling particularly unfriendly) is to take the Acorn of Ages on a Spellweaver, and the Moonstone of Hidden Ways on a Glade Captain. With any luck, you'll be starting the game with 4 woods that you can add to the terrain (or any existing woods) and provide you with even more immediate board control. Take Calaingor's Stave as well, and cast the spell "Tree Singing" on an enemy unit within a forest, and do immediate damage, or keep them surrounded by the woods that you brought along with you, forcing dangerous terrain tests, all game long. I have utterly demolished armies using this tactic, weakening them to the point of breaking, only to have a unit of 30 Wildwood Rangers suddenly appear in a forest behind them (that they just made it out of), and a unit of Treekin in front of them, all the while being peppered by arrows. That's rough. I usually feel pretty guilty after playing that build, so I try not to do it very often.
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Post by KevinC on Jan 16, 2019 13:28:46 GMT
THESE GUYS! ----------These Unicorns look great!
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Post by DiscoQing on Jan 16, 2019 17:51:51 GMT
I play Brets normally, never really been scared of Woodies.
So I say "none".
When playing dwarfs though, anything that shoots!
And when playing High Elves I always put it down to the roll of the dice, hehe.
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Post by mottdon on Jan 16, 2019 19:00:54 GMT
I play Brets normally, never really been scared of Woodies. So I say "none". When playing dwarfs though, anything that shoots! And when playing High Elves I always put it down to the roll of the dice, hehe. How do you handle the Waywatcher's "no armor saves" shots? Seems as though that would rip away at those lance formations. Even Lords/Captains can have access to a -3 armor save modifier with Arcane Bodkins. I'd think that a Captain on a Great Eagle would give Brets fits. I don't have an overabundance of experience with Brets, so I really don't know. This also make me wonder, since a common tactic with Brets is to protect a Damsel in the middle of the second row, can she still be targeted by the Waystalker's Sniper ability, or is he forced to only target the first row?
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Post by DiscoQing on Jan 16, 2019 19:18:01 GMT
Not enough shots to worry about, Use terrain, target saturation - push forward for pressure etc...
I'm usually in combat and I don't have to worry about being shot.
I don't use the Lance formation when fighting woodies, I just go in 1 line - very hard to flank / avoid - but as they're only elves I can easily win combat.
I use life magic too, so regrow some knights.
The first units to be targeted, almost always are - Trebs and Pegs.
I always put 1 treb in each corner (that's right, I use them as chaff - they never hit anyway!), meaning the usual 2 units of WW are next to them... Resulting in my knights not taking hits.
Maybe I have too much experience vs. Woodies, but I've only lost against them once (3 great eagle riding heroes, a treeman and a lord on a dragon). It was such a peculiar and maneuverable build I couldnt use my tactics...
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Post by mottdon on Jan 16, 2019 19:57:10 GMT
Yeah, Wood Elves are best when employed in a "hit and run" tactic. If you can catch them, then you stand a good chance of beating them, but any player worth his salt, will use plenty of redirectors and keep hard units circling all game, while shooting the heck out of them. They are definitely a finesse army that is for the more advanced players, but in the right general's hands, they could be nearly impossible to beat.
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Post by saniles on Jan 16, 2019 23:07:33 GMT
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Post by livewaaaaagh on Jan 16, 2019 23:09:10 GMT
Stay tuned for a Battle Report soon with Wood Elves then... not quite playin them as Hit and run!
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Post by DiscoQing on Jan 16, 2019 23:16:35 GMT
I agree hit and run is best for elves. And I find that easy to beat with Brets.
Yet to try them with my ogres though.
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Post by KevinC on Jan 17, 2019 14:53:00 GMT
In prior editions, I always found Wood Elves extremely frustrating to play against. The skirmisher rules in prior editions were too good, and could really be abused by a cunning player...the all skirmisher armies were very powerful and Wood Elves were one example of that (thank goodness 8th edition fixed this and forced players to build proper armies!).
The Treeman is my most feared unit from the Wood Elves. They are just really tough to kill, T6, 3+ armour; refuse to break (LD 9 with Stubborn) and can cause a great deal of damage. Facing a pair of them on the table is a scary proposition, especially for a poor S3 Gobbo!
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Post by sedge on Jan 17, 2019 19:48:09 GMT
While Woodies have lots of good units, they don't have a stand-out one that opponents absolutely hate, like WoC Daemon Princes. It's the combination of them all running around the place, pincushioning you as you struggle to pin them down that's frustrating.
If I had to pick a unit, it'd probably be the humble Glade Guard, filling up your opponent's core allowance with a unit that will pour death on you from afar, with an extremely versatile selection of magic arrow upgrades. Of course, Deepwood Scouts are more manoeuvrable, and Waywatchers are nasty, but neither are core, so aren't nearly as numerous.
Alternatively, if you're fielding an army with army-wide Fear and minimal ranged threat (VC, Daemons) then those opposing Wildwood Rangers are budget Swordmasters.
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Post by imrillion on Jan 20, 2019 22:19:54 GMT
Ok, since I'm looking at woodies fairly soon, and i love modeling the deepwood scouts, I gotta ask, are these guys in the running for a scary unit? I know they aren't WW BUT if you kit them out with moonfire or starfire they come in at 3 points less than WW and can be used in the same capacity. also freeing up that rare slot? Ovs Im far more at home with my Druchii lists but i look at them and see them as a budget version of the WW.
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Post by strutsagget on Jan 21, 2019 6:36:55 GMT
Ok, since I'm looking at woodies fairly soon, and i love modeling the deepwood scouts, I gotta ask, are these guys in the running for a scary unit? I know they aren't WW BUT if you kit them out with moonfire or starfire they come in at 3 points less than WW and can be used in the same capacity. also freeing up that rare slot? Ovs Im far more at home with my Druchii lists but i look at them and see them as a budget version of the WW. Well WW has better BS and the second anti-armor ability is pretty awesome at S3. With that said scouts are awesome. With poison, they are one of the best WM hunters.
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