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Post by thefatandroid on Feb 1, 2019 1:57:34 GMT
So I've been messing around with a stormvermin and warlord list to take on all comers. This is what I've come up with:
2000/2000
Lord's 523
Greyseer foul pendant, earthing rod 295
Warlord shield, war litter, dragonhelm, sword of antiheros, talisman of preservation, other tricksters shard 228
Heros
Chieftain BSB, shield, storm banner 122
Warlock engineer level 2, dispel scroll 125
Warlock engineer doom rocket 45
Warlock engineer obsidian lodestone 60
Core
26 clanrats with shields, standard, musician
38 stormvermin champion, musician, razor standard 336
39 slaves musician 80
40 slaves musician 82
Special
6 gutter runners with slings and poison attacks 108
Rare
Doomwheel 150
Doomwheel 150
Warp lightning cannon 90
Pretty basic formation with stormvermin in front in horde, slaves in bus on either side then bunker behind with the BSB, greyseer, lvl2 WE and MR WE. Doomwheels on the flanks to take out monsters and get around for flank attacks. Gutter runners either scout or ambush depending on my opponent. Slaves time up scary units and allow magic and the WLC to blast things in combat. The stormvermin try to get into combat as fast as possible preferably with a unit that has lots of units to feed to my warlord. Anything that I could change here?
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Post by saniles on Feb 1, 2019 3:41:42 GMT
Do your opponents typically take a decent amount of characters?
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Post by jukei on Feb 1, 2019 10:27:59 GMT
Have you considered the idea to take Queek Headtaker ?
His storm vermin are a an "elite" -
Queek has AS 3+, not so good protection ...but you can deploy him in a bunker behind the lines and still have the advantage to take his storm vermin bulked on the battlefield
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Post by thefatandroid on Feb 2, 2019 0:29:50 GMT
My opponents usually take around 3-5 characters. Last match they had 3 characters in a huge block of sea guard with the BotWD. I still need to figure out a way to stop that unit since most the skaven attacks count as magical.
For queek I could take him but he can't join my bunker unit since it'll have a greyseer. The only place would be in the stormvermin or slaves. I do like the extra WS and Init but they are a huge target. The storm banner helps but not by much.
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Post by crownprinceimrik on Feb 2, 2019 10:28:27 GMT
I'm not sure I agree with using Queek but not having him in CC. He's a CC lord and not a cheap one at that, he needs to be in close combat. Against some lords he'll die very quickly, mainly any decent CC character with ASF, but he can kill non-ASF characters reasonably well, so I'd not be afraid to have him in CC. He can also just try to cut through units too.
The Sea Guard block isn't that good. It can be a bit annoying to deal with as Skaven, though, because you've got so many magical attacks. I normally never suggest this because I hate the spell and think it's broken, but your opponent is bringing the BotWD so it's fair game. The Dreaded 13th will wreck the unit, and you can always choose to have it in a game. There are other ways too. Most Skaven ranged weapons won't work, so you'll need to get into CC with them. Fortunately, Sea Guard are not good in CC. I'd suggest a Hellpit Abomination or a horde of Plague Monks with a Furnace. The Sea Guard will start dying very quickly, and if you give the Monks the Plague Banner, all the better. The most important thing to do is to kill the BotWD. Since Sea Guard cannot carry it naturally, they need to have the BSB in there. Focus every attack that can into the BSB and kill him. He'll have 2 wounds and at best a 4+ Armor, 6+ Ward. Not too hard to get through with a bunch of Plague Monk attacks that reroll to wound! Once the Banner is dead the unit will follow relatively quickly. Howling Warpgale and the Storm Banner will help shield your units as they approach CC with the Sea Guard. If your opponent has a wizard casting High Magic in the unit it will be harder to kill them off, but they won't hit any harder so something like a Hellpit could tie them up for a very long time.
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Post by saniles on Feb 2, 2019 15:48:26 GMT
I’d be concerned about the double doomwheels with so much shooting on their side. Wounds outside of combat is dangerous for them. So be careful with those.
I do not have any moral issues with the 13th. Skaven have continued to get weaker with the additional updates books imo. The 13th is the most expensive spell in the game and you basically HAVE to miscast if you want it to go off most of the time lol. I say go for it dude!!
Your list looks fine.
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Post by thefatandroid on Feb 3, 2019 17:38:03 GMT
I tried to get my greyseer in range and line of sight for the 13th but with terrain I couldn't get it off. I need to get a little better at maneuvering my forces for line of sight.
Funny question, do your troops block line of sight?
My friend always seems to win with his high elves but always takes the BotWD and book of hoeth. Two of the most broken items in the game, IMO. And that's coming from a skaven player.
The double doomwheels are there to soak more shots in the shooting phase. Give my opponent more things to think about. If they can kill off his Phoenix then all the better. I would take two WLC but my luck with the artillery dice hasn't been that great lately. Last game the one cannon shot the other twice with misfires. But honestly that's what I love about skaven the most. Everything is expendable and can go horribly wrong and you just have to laugh about those situations.
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Post by sedge on Feb 4, 2019 11:25:37 GMT
Funny question, do your troops block line of sight? WFB uses "True Line of Sight" so you literally have to get down to eye level on the battlefield and "see" from your Seer's position whether they can see your desired target. Chuck him on a tall scenic base for a somewhat sneaky way of improving your view. EDIT: Nevermind, I see the thread on it here: eefl.freeforums.net/thread/1533/line-sight |
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Post by rahotep75 on Feb 5, 2019 4:27:09 GMT
If your opponent often takes the Banner of the World Dragon, why don't you use that against him? Drop most of your magical attacks and make him waste those points.
Personally, I feel like you have way too few units. Having more units will give you some more flexibility in choosing your fights. As it is, you really only have one threat unit, the Stormvermin. If he neutralizes that, then you've got nothing. The doomwheels are nice, and I never leave home without them, but they aren't really unit breakers, so you can't really count on them to win a legit combat.
My suggestions:
Drop anti heros on Warlord, give him a halberd and poison attacks. Cheaper, non-magical, and you are still wounding weedy elves on a 2.
Drop Grey seer and one slave unit, convert to two clanrat units 35 or so. This gives you two more units that can win combats, even against elves.
Drop WLC and take another Gutter Runner unit. They can help take care of his eagles, or whatever and can still do some damage to his seaguard. Also, give them snare nets. His elves wont be able to re-roll misses if you get into CC.
I would drop the two cheap engineers and get some small giant rat packs. They can help re-direct and maybe mess with his positioning for his seaguard unit, so that maybe your other units can get a flank charge.
Give you something like this:
Warlord
BSB
Warlock
Stormvermin
Clanrats x3
Slaves x2
Giant Rats x2
Gutter Runners x2
Doomwheels x2
This gives you many more threats, at least to elven units, and it gives you almost nothing that is severely weakened by the BoTWD. And I feel it still has more strengths against all comers, simply because of numbers and tactical flexibility.
Just my thoughts.
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Post by saniles on Feb 5, 2019 17:27:04 GMT
If your opponent often takes the Banner of the World Dragon, why don't you use that against him? Drop most of your magical attacks and make him waste those points. Personally, I feel like you have way too few units. Having more units will give you some more flexibility in choosing your fights. As it is, you really only have one threat unit, the Stormvermin. If he neutralizes that, then you've got nothing. The doomwheels are nice, and I never leave home without them, but they aren't really unit breakers, so you can't really count on them to win a legit combat. My suggestions: Drop anti heros on Warlord, give him a halberd and poison attacks. Cheaper, non-magical, and you are still wounding weedy elves on a 2. Drop Grey seer and one slave unit, convert to two clanrat units 35 or so. This gives you two more units that can win combats, even against elves. Drop WLC and take another Gutter Runner unit. They can help take care of his eagles, or whatever and can still do some damage to his seaguard. Also, give them snare nets. His elves wont be able to re-roll misses if you get into CC. I would drop the two cheap engineers and get some small giant rat packs. They can help re-direct and maybe mess with his positioning for his seaguard unit, so that maybe your other units can get a flank charge. Give you something like this: Warlord BSB Warlock Stormvermin Clanrats x3 Slaves x2 Giant Rats x2 Gutter Runners x2 Doomwheels x2 This gives you many more threats, at least to elven units, and it gives you almost nothing that is severely weakened by the BoTWD. And I feel it still has more strengths against all comers, simply because of numbers and tactical flexibility. Just my thoughts. Magic hater! Lmao. I built out the list over breakfast this morning, that’s sooo many rats. Can’t wait try out these lists of yours that have far less magic potency than I typically use. I think it will shock my opponents |
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Post by rahotep75 on Feb 5, 2019 18:48:24 GMT
Magic hater! Lmao. I built out the list over breakfast this morning, that’s sooo many rats. Can’t wait try out these lists of yours that have far less magic potency than I typically use. I think it will shock my opponents Hope you enjoy them when you try them out. With Skaven, while I love their toys, I feel that numbers win the day. |
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