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Post by mottdon on Jul 20, 2017 21:12:29 GMT
So this is my first attempt at an all-comers Empire list that includes Elspeth Von Draken on Carmine Dragon. Let me know what you think.
Lords: Elspeth Von Draken on Carmine Dragon - 590 pts
Heroes: Captain (BSB, Full Plate Armor, Enchanted Shield, Warrior Bane) - 101 pts Warrior Priest (Heavy Armor, Shield, Tormentor Sword) - 74 Battle Wizard (Dispel Scroll, Lore of Light) - 90
Core: 40 Swordsmen (Full Command) - 310 pts [Detachment] 20 Halberdiers - 120 pts [Detachment] 20 Halberdiers - 120 pts 35 Militia - 210 pts
Special: Great Cannon - 120 pts Great Cannon - 120 pts 4 Demigryph Knights (Full Command, Banner of Eternal Flame) - 264 pts
Rare: Steam Tank - 250 pts Luminark of Hysh - 130 pts
Total: 2499
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Post by frozenfood on Jul 21, 2017 7:17:14 GMT
Okay,plenty of options for your magic dice. 4 demis is not bad. I prefer 5 but yeah. The champion is for challenges? Usually don't take that. Dragon is cool. No engineer or witch hunter, but who has points for that Original list, go for it
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Post by Naitsabes on Jul 21, 2017 7:53:22 GMT
she does death magic, right? so maybe there are ways to capitalize on what that does to enemy leadership beyond here own terror dragon? hard to do with Empire. there is that magic item that makes you cause fear (or was it terror).
the other thing to consider is hunting down enemy cannons, that is the primary thing to worry about. so maybe a Pegasus captain? I guess you do have plenty cannons of your own for counter battery fire already
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Post by Horace on Jul 21, 2017 9:12:51 GMT
With 2 Cannons & a Steam Tank already is the Luminark really worth it? I would perhaps put those points into something else like some Knights or a Hellblaster
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Post by mahbruck on Jul 21, 2017 9:53:04 GMT
Ok, just checked my Tamurkhan book, Elspeth actually has T4 and -1 to wound and can recover 1 wound per turn so she's pretty tough, for a wizard, that is. But no ward save of any kind and has access to lore with no regenerating ability (like soulstealer of Dark Magic and generally Life Magic), I think she must be very lucky to survive past turn 2. May be just dump the Luminark and squeeze a Life wizard level 4 instead of just a lowly light mage. Better chance to have Regrowth and the double threat of Dweller and Purple Sun. Also if one of them die, the magic would not lose any potency.
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Post by mottdon on Jul 21, 2017 14:05:05 GMT
Well, there are a couple of reasons I included the Luminark.
First, my usual opponent is a VC player. (That's also the reason for the Lv1 Light Wizard. I did consider a Life Wizard for the very point of healing her.) The Luminark's Cannon would be a great thing to counter to many of their units. With that weapon, it also brings this list up to 4 cannons! I know that I said that this would be an "All Comers" list, and I want it to be, but it is very likely that I will be facing VC and WE a lot. I MIGHT be facing an Ogre army soon though too.
Secondly, since Elspeth is already rather defensive in the magic phase with her Lv4 + 1 to her dispel roll, adding 1 dispel dice from the Luminark can really help to shut down a magic phase. The Lv1 Light mage is little more than a scroll caddy, but the threat of his magic missile is still nothing to overlook.
Third, the infantry would need as much protection as possible while Elspeth does her thing and the cannons go to town. A 6++ ward save can come in handy. If I trimmed some points off the Militia and added a Witch Hunter in with the Swordmen, then that'd give them a 4++ vs magic. Not too shabby. I'm still wrestling with that one.
The Champ on the Demigryphs is something else to consider. I don't have my book with me, so when I added him, I was thinking of putting a cheap magical weapon on him so that they don't get pinned down by Etherial units, but I can't remember if he can actually take a magical weapon. Does anyone know? The other reason for adding him is because of Vampires. They kill pretty much everything they touch. He could at least challenge and take the hits for the unit.
I have played a few games with two Lv4 Wizards, and it's certainly nice to have the spell options, but I've found that I rarely use nearly all of them. Elspeth is clearly going to be the main threat and the entire army will be revolving around her, so the majority of my Power Dice will be devoted to giving her optimum match-ups and taking out my opponents characters. When you add in other spells like the Luminark's cannon, the warrior priest's prayers, and the Light (or Life) Wizard's spell, then that totals 12 different spells to choose from. Adding another 3 spells won't make that much difference, IMHO.
Anyway, these are some of my preliminary thoughts behind this list. Please keep the ideas and comments coming! If I'm just wrong on things like the Luminark, tell me! This is the whole point of the thread. I'm not saying that anyone is wrong, I'm just trying to think through any and all reasons for including things and letting you guys know my thought process. Let me know my errors!
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Post by mottdon on Jul 21, 2017 14:12:54 GMT
Okay, here's a refined list (by a little bit). What do you think about this? And should I swap out the 30 Militia for 30 Spearmen with Shields in bus formation for more defense?
Lords:
Elspeth Von Draken on Carmine Dragon - 590 pts
Heroes:
Captain (BSB, Full Plate Armor, Enchanted Shield, Warrior Bane) - 101 pts
Warrior Priest (Heavy Armor, Shield,) - 69
Battle Wizard (Dispel Scroll, Lore of Light) - 90
Witch Hunter (Brace of Pistols) - 55
Core:
40 Swordsmen (Standard, Musician) - 300 pts
[Detachment] 20 Halberdiers - 120 pts
[Detachment] 20 Halberdiers - 120 pts
30 Militia - 180 pts
Special:
Great Cannon - 120 pts
Great Cannon - 120 pts
4 Demigryph Knights (Standard, Musician, Banner of Eternal Flame) - 254 pts
Rare:
Steam Tank - 250 pts
Luminark of Hysh - 130 pts
Total: 2499
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Post by knoffles on Jul 21, 2017 17:58:01 GMT
Bar the dragon it looks similar to many an empire list that has spanked me
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Post by grandmasterwang on Aug 5, 2017 9:54:02 GMT
Okay, here's a refined list (by a little bit). What do you think about this? And should I swap out the 30 Militia for 30 Spearmen with Shields in bus formation for more defense? Lords:Elspeth Von Draken on Carmine Dragon - 590 pts Heroes:Captain (BSB, Full Plate Armor, Enchanted Shield, Warrior Bane) - 101 pts Warrior Priest (Heavy Armor, Shield,) - 69 Battle Wizard (Dispel Scroll, Lore of Light) - 90 Witch Hunter (Brace of Pistols) - 55 Core:40 Swordsmen (Standard, Musician) - 300 pts [Detachment] 20 Halberdiers - 120 pts [Detachment] 20 Halberdiers - 120 pts 30 Militia - 180 pts Special:Great Cannon - 120 pts Great Cannon - 120 pts 4 Demigryph Knights (Standard, Musician, Banner of Eternal Flame) - 254 pts Rare:Steam Tank - 250 pts Luminark of Hysh - 130 pts Total: 2499 Don't really know enough about the Empire to give solid/worthwhile advice but I want to see you try this list badly. Espleth is such an amazing model.
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