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Post by Horace on Sept 18, 2018 14:55:35 GMT
I said I would put this together so here is my take on O&G units and the options in the book
I see O&G as an out of control wrecking ball of an army. They have the potential to throw out huge amounts of damage to their opponents but are highly unpredictable and prone to snatching defeat from the jaws of victory with a few bad rolls. For the more faint hearted among us, you can try to mitigate some of this with various selections/non-selections but personally I think you should just embrace it and take the rough with the smooth.
Core Options:
Night Goblins: Probably the most common core pick. 3 points each, pretty garbage stats-wise as they are carrying -1 Ld over regular goblins. However NG have several significant advantages, the first being netters, at 45 points for the entire unit (so the bigger the unit the better the value) you can pretty consistently (don't roll 1) reduce the enemy's strength by 1. This is very handy for gimping enemy units and bogging them down even longer. The second is fanatics which can cause huge amounts of damage and can potentially gimp the enemies charge, unless they are willing to move into the fanatic and take 2D6 S5 Armour Piercing hits, but come in at 25 points each. Best employed in large tarpits which have the ability to hurt the enemy through their tricks, and also carry some fear factor just through the potential to have fanatics. Can also take bows for free.
Goblins: Similar to NG in that essentially they are good for taking as large tar pits. They have an extra pip of Ld but 1 less I. They also have Light armour rather than shields, which they can take for an extra half a point and improve to 5+ AS. The goblin upgrade option is Nasty Skulkers, which for 10 points each have ASF 2 attacks and Killing Blow in the first round of combat. I guess you are hoping they pop out and manage to KB a BSB or enemy character, probably not worth the points. Goblins also have to pay for their short bows (an extra half a point) which is annoying. Can potentially have some fun with the Spider banner stacked with Gift of the Spider God giving them a lot of 5+ Poisoned Arrows but it is probably not worth the 85 point price tag and having to have it on your BSB.
Orc Boyz: You know what they do, they are standard Orcs which means they are pretty tough, and at 6 points each not bad value. With the Choppas special rule they are S4 T4 in the first round of combat, and can take an additional hand weapon for an extra point (which is well worth it in my opinion). They are a bit overlooked in my opinion because everyone opts for the Savage variety, but Orc Boyz have the benefit of not being frenzied so giving you a morsel more control over your army. Can be upgraded to Big 'Uns for +1WS and +1S for 2 points a model. Always use your Big 'Uns upgrade on something.
Orc Arrer Boyz: I am currently trying Arrer Boyz out as small flanking forces. They are Orcs, so they are tough and can fight to the extent that most redirectors/fast cavalry/chaff will have to think twice about engaging them. Then they can pepper the enemy with some poorly directed arrows too... proper bows at least.
Savage Orc Arrer Boys: As above but even meaner in close combat. Downside is they are frenzied so may go charging off.
Savage Orcs: Everyone's favourite core choice. Great value at 8 points each, 9 when you take the obligatory additional hand weapon. These fellas are frenzied and have warpaint which means they are throwing out 3 Strength 4 Attacks each and have a 6++ save. Add 1 to that Strength if you take the Big 'Uns upgrade and 1 to their warpaint ward save if you take the Lucky Shrunken Head on a Shamen in the unit. Savage Orc Big 'Uns are probably the internet's choice, with fairly good reason. You do need to be wary of the frenzy though, if you go big on this unit you are likely to have this unit baited and forced to over run somewhere, and it will attract a lot of attention.
Goblin Wolf Riders: The O&G Fast cavalry option. They have M9 and can carry short bows and clock in at 10 points vanilla.
Forest Goblin Spider Riders: A more expensive option than Wolf Riders. These gain a poisoned attack from the spider and Forest Strider & Creeping Assault but are only M7. I prefer the Wolf Rider option.
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Post by Horace on Sept 18, 2018 15:58:57 GMT
Special Options:
Wow O&G are really spoilt for choice throughout their book!
Orc Boar Boyz: I have never used these. I am currently assembling a unit and Gorbad Ironclaw so this is purely theroretical. They are as heavy as Orc Cavalry gets, which is not true heavy cavalry. They pack a 3+ AS if you cough up for the shields but pack a reasonable punch considering the Boar & Orc both hit at S5 on the charge (assuming you paid for the spears too...). But they do clock in at 20 points each. I don't think they are the most bang for your buck in reality but they have some utility.
Savage Orc Boar Boyz: The Savage variety of Boar Boy trades off the survivability of the regular flavour for more attacks essentially. These guys only have a 5+ 6++ save but on the other hand with frenzy and the additional hand weapon which they are allowed to take, it gives them 3 attacks each so they hit like a ton of bricks. Can be Frenzy baited so careful placement is essential due to their extended possible charge range.
Black Orcs: The premium infantry choice in my opinion, but at a cost. They come in at 12 points each so you are paying 3 extra points on a Savage Orc, plus 1 extra if you want the shields (I don't ta). However these guys are essentially Big'uns with the extra WS and S, plus they are also Immune to Psychology, Animosity, and can choose which type of weapon to fight with. I am a big fan of them, they will probably attract a lot of fire due to their relative lack of armour compared to other race's elites and the fact they can hit at S7 in the first round of combat. Noone wants to be facing that.
Goblin Spear Chukka: It's a 35 point Bolt Thrower but unfortunately it is shooting at BS2 and also misfires on a 1 to hit. You can add an Orc Bully for 10 points to improve the BS to 3. I don't think I've ever actually hit anything with mine.. but if you have 35 points spare at the end and you're feeling lucky..
Goblin Wolf Chariot: It's a 50 point chariot that hits at S5 but is pretty fragile. They are also very rapid and can be fielded in units (I would not do this however, due to poor Goblin leadership and spreading the threat). A good option for charge support or clearing chaff.
Orc Boar Chariot: A more serious option that the Wolf Chariot, but slower and more costly at 85 points. This version is S5 T5 W4 4+AS and gets the Tusker Charge bonus to it's Boars. It is a pretty mean chariot really, if you can stomach the cost and the slowness.
Trolls: Everyone's favourite, regenerating, pukey, stupid Trolls. 35 point MI that is S5 T4 W3 A3 and has a 4++ thanks to Regeneration. They can make puke attacks which trade all their attacks for 1 automatically hitting S5 hit, which allows no armour saves. The drawbacks are Stupidity coupled with Leadership 4 which means it is essential they are kept within the Leadership bubble of the general, or are babysat by a character. They really do have great utility though, they can chew through infantry because they are cheap enough to be fielded in numbers and get to make 3 supporting attacks plus a stomp. They can hurt armoured troops through their high S and puke. They can also take a real beating because of their 4++ save, assuming you stay away from fire.
Snotlings: It's a long time since I cracked out my Snotlings I must say. They are Swarms, which suck. The only plus point is the Exploding Spore shooting attack they can make, which hits automatically and allows no Armour saves, albeit at S2 with a 6" range. Not worth 30 points.
Night Goblin Squig Herd: I like these, classic O&G forces of destruction. Squigs each get 2 attacks at WS4 and S5. If the unit flees from combat (it is Immune to Psychology), or if you fail to keep 1 Goblin present for every 3 Squigs, the Squigs Go Wild, hitting every unit within 2D6" for D6 +1 (for every 5 squigs which are left) S5 hits. Don't take too many Goblins, take lots of Squigs, shunt it towards something valuable and let it go about it's business. It will kill stuff either way! Squigs are 8 points each though so it isn't the cheapest unit in the world.
Night Goblin Squig Hoppers: Skirmishing, Squig riding cavalry. The riders are pretty crap so you are relying on the Squig doing the damage. These are best employed as War Machine/flank/chaff hunters. They have no armour which means they will get shot to pieces straight away, however they do have an interesting advantage which is their Random Movement. This means enemies can not declare charge reactions against them (flee or stand and shoot) which is great for clearing chaff/light cavalry. It also means they can pivot/charge/move through 360 degrees. If the unit is joined by a Big Boss on a Giant Cave Squig it actually gets quite punchy and can re-roll it's Random Movement. An interesting option which doesn't seem to be used too often.
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Post by Horace on Sept 18, 2018 15:59:08 GMT
Rare Options:
Another option-rich category for O&G to choose from. Tough decisions required
Mangler Squig: Truly excellent, will have your enemy extremely nervous and will almost certainly be targeted to try and eradicate it before you can reach their lines. A mere 65 points buys you a super fanatic with 3 wounds and proper Random Movement. If it hits a unit it causes 2D6 S6 Armour Piercing hits. If the enemy wishes to remove the squig rather than shoot it, it must move a unit into the squig taking a total of 3D6 S6 AP hits. Hand of Gork is also excellent in combination with a Mangler and will make your opponent wet themselves. There aren't really many reasons not to take a Mangler (or two)
River Trolls: I love River Trolls, I have a unit of the cool old metal ones but sadly they usually get thrown down as regular Trolls. They are only 10 points extra compared to a regular Troll, gaining River Strider & Marsh Strider and also getting the Nurgle effect of -1 to hit in close combat, making them even harder to shift. But the movement of them from Special to Rare means I can never make room for them.
Stone Trolls: Another excellent option. This flavour gets you Magic Resistance (2) and Scaly Skin (5+), again making them even harder to shift, particularly if someone tries to be cute and bring some fire to the party. But again, they suffer the same problems as River Trolls in that they come from your incredibly busy Rare allowance.
Snotling Pump Wagon: Another classic O&G unit which falls into the unpredictable force of destruction category. Only 45 points pre-upgrades (it has several nice options) it provides another Random Movement option which is great for clearing out any light cavalry or avoidance units. Although quite fragile Pump Wagons put out 2D6 Impact hits at vanilla, Strength 4. A Spiky Roller upgrade gives you S5 for 15 points. An Outrigga gives you 3D6 movement and an option to Pump Harder for 4D6, although this risks losing control (10 points). Flappas cost you 5 points and allow you to avoid Dangerous Terrain, so well worth it if you play on scenery heavy tables. Giant Explodin' Spores cost 15 points and do not allow Armour Saves versus the impact hits. A very nice option against heavily armoured foes. This is another unit you will put down and the enemy will be forced into trying to remove it early.
Giant: I like Giants, I know most people hate them because they have basically no save, but the enemy can only shoot/magic so many things before you get to them and I think I have already mentioned quite a few things which require this sort of attention already. True Giants clock in at 200 points compared to less than that for other threats, but if they do reach the enemy they can cause horrific amounts of damage. Giants make special attacks according to a chart, plus a Thunderstomp at S6. Against "Man-sized things" a 1 results in a Yell and Bawl, not the best, you automatically win the combat by 2 but make no attacks. A roll of 2 means you Jump Up and Down, and continue to Jump Up and Down until you fall over or win. This causes 2D6 S6 hits. A roll of a 3 lets you pick a model from the unit to Pick Up and.. hopefully eat. This can remove characters without saves on a 4+ but allows them a single attack to try and break free. A roll of 4-6 inflicts D6 S6 hits on the unit. Against "Big Things" a roll of 2-4 is Thump with Club, the model must take an I test (lowest value if more than 1 profile) or take 2D6 wounds with no Armour save. A 5-6 is 'Eadbutt automatically causing a single wound with no armour saves, and causing the enemy to lose all of their subsequent attacks (if you wound). They are very random which many people hate lots and lots. You can kill them with cannons which apparently is what happens to everything. I have the attitude if they are shooting at my Giants, they are not shooting at something else which also requires a lot of attention. Can be run out on a flank quite successfully due to being Stubborn and Ld10.
Arachnarok Spiders: Big ass spider with some nice rules, but it does come on a very big base and isn't cheap. These are rapid with M7, Swiftstride and various Strider and obstacle-ignoring rules. It is Stubborn & Immune to Psychology which is helpful because it only comes with stock Ld6. The spider itself has 8 poisoned S5 attacks, one of which causes D6 wounds. It's Goblin crew can also make 8 attacks. It has a 4+ save, T6 and W8 in terms of protection, so like Giants, these will go down under sustained fire, especially due to the gigantic base it comes on. However this is another unit which can benefit from target saturation. Can be taken as a mount for a Goblin Great Shaman who can also take a Catchweb Shrine for Loremaster and +2 to channeling attempts. This shifts the spider into your Lords allowance, but also means your Shaman is now on a very big base with a sign around his neck saying shoot me. Invest in some ward save if you do this.
Goblin Rock Lobber: A standard Stone Thrower for 85 points. Great for killing those big multi-wound enemies. The middle of the template is S9 with D6 wounds. Also fairly decent against big blocks of infantry, no-one likes templates landing on them.
Doom Diver Catapult: Heavily armoured enemies will hate you. A bit like a Stone Thrower except you can correct your course D6" from the scatter so you are generally hitting something. This causes D6 S5 hits with no armour saves allowed. Shoot the things with the highest save.
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Post by Horace on Sept 18, 2018 15:59:26 GMT
Characters:
Orc Warboss/Big Boss: Generic Orc lord/hero choice. No fancy rules and won't go toe-to-toe with a Chaos Lord but they are cheap at 115/55 points and are also good options for adding some killing power to units. Savage Orc Warboss/Big Boss: As above but you get Warpaint for a 6++ and Frenzy for a bit more damage output. If he is in that Savage Orc horde containing the Shaman and the Lucky Shrunken Head you are up to a 5++ for free (kind of). Black Orc Warboss/Big Boss: A good chunk more expensive at 160/90 but they get 1 extra WS and the Quell Animosity rule, along with the standard Black Orc ones. The internet loves these because they hate animosity and you ignore failed tests for D6 S5 hits with these in units. Handy if you have put too many eggs in too few baskets, and can not afford for a unit to fail an animosity test. Night Goblin/Goblin Warboss/Big Boss: Super cheap option which can either be employed to add damage output to those big units, or as lone characters on Gigantic Spiders/Wolves/Great Cave Squigs to go War Machine hunting. Savage Orc/Orc Shaman: Lets you access the Spells of Da Big Waaagh. Can be mounted on Wyverns or Boars. The Savage variety is often seen sporting the Lucky Shrunken Head in a horde of Savage Orc Big 'Uns. Night Goblin/Goblin Shaman: these cast from Spells of Da Little Waaagh, which quite frankly is not as good, but they are cheaper and offer a second casting option. Especially Night Goblin Shamans, who get a free Magic Mushroom casting dice to roll, although this can cause you some harm. Very useful for a secondary caster to try and draw out some dispel dice. The Goblin flavour can be mounted on the big spider. Gigantic Spiders: A 40 point mount upgrade for your Goblins, remember that you are almost better off just sticking a Big Boss on it, because you will get the free wound upgrade from the spider. Adds +2 to your Armour save and provides M7 and all the Obstacle-ignoring rules spiders have along with 3 poisoned S4 attacks. Useful for War Machine hunting/babysitting. Wyverns: I am not scared of sticking my general on a monster although many people are. Gets you the 18" Ld bubble and allows you to fly. My beef with Wyverns is they cost 160 points and only have 3 attacks each. True they are Poisoned Attacks and are WS5 S6, plus the Thunderstomp, but I always feel a little short-changed. Can be useful for sticking an Orc Shaman on, provides some mobility and some extra CC protection at the cost of making him substantially more shoot-able. Fortune favours the brave Great Cave Squig: Similar to the Gigantic Spider except it costs 50 points and is a little stronger in CC. Also gives the Squig Hoppers a bonus if the Big Boss joins them. Gorbad Ironclaw: Gorbad is great at killing but not so great at taking damage. He comes in at 375 points but for that he is your BSB & General rolled into one. This is a blessing and a curse, DO NOT ALLOW HIM TO BREAK! He will be instantly removed as per the BSB rules. It does offer you an increased Inspiring Presence bubble of 18" and he also has his own animosity-removing bubble of 18". He can upgrade as many units to Big 'Uns as you like. He gets 4 Always Strike First attacks at WS7 S5 (6 in the first round) I5 with no armour saves allowed and Multiple Wounds (D3). That is a pretty scary proposition. The downside is (and a pretty major one at that) he has no ward save, so you are reliant on his T5 and 3+ AS for protection. Azhag the Slaughterer: He is super expensive at 550 points as he is pretty beastly in combat whilst also being a Lvl3 Death wizard, which is a super interesting option as there is no other access to this lore. He comes atop his Wyvern (so gets all those benefits mentioned earlier) and gets a 4+ 5++ save from his armour. He hits with 5 attacks, re-rolling misses in the first round of combat, at S5 (6 in the first round). He also allows re-rolls on failed animosity within 18". But 550 points is steep. Skarsnik & Gobbla: Skarsnik weighs in at 275 points. He comes with some really nice benefits, his Sneaky Schemes has gimped many people I have faced, delaying units and forcing them to enter as reinforcements on their first turn. Amusing when you delay enemy War Machines etc. Tricksy Traps is vaguely useful in that it allows rallying Night Goblin units to move and shoot in the turn they rally. His Prodder is pretty sweet, a Bound spell (5) Magic Missile which does D3 S6 hits, increased to D6 if you are within 12" of a NG horde (which you should be) with no armour saves allowed. Between him and Gobbla he also gets 8 attacks, 4 of which are at S6 with Killing Blow. The downside is, which is hard to get away from, he has no save besides some Light Armour, so you only have T4 and 6 Wounds for protection. You don't really want him fighting too many hard hitting enemies, definitely have some big bosses for protection and place him on a corner. Grom the Paunch: Grom is another General come BSB rolled into one. He comes with a Chariot (S5 T4 W3 5+ 5++) which is fairly hardy as chariots go and has WS5 S6 Killing Blow, 5+ 5++ and Regeneration. All in all I think Grom is pretty decent, he hits hard and has some pretty decent protection as far as O&G go. Wurrzag: I've never used him but he clocks in at 350 points compared to a normal SO Lvl 4 at 205 points. He is a level 4 caster with an extra spell which can instantly kill enemy wizards within 12", assuming you roll a 6 and successfully cast it. He also has a Vindictive Glare bound spell and best of all he can store a dice for his power pools, has Magic Resistance (3) and can re-roll miscast results. Also has a 5++. He is pretty decent but I'm not entirely sure he is worth the cost. Grimgor Ironhide: I don't know why, but I really don't like Grimgor. Perhaps it is his backstory, he just doesn't do it for me. He is certainly hard as nails though. He must take his Black Orc bodyguard who get +1WS and Hatred. He hits with ASF at S7 (S8 in the first round), has Hatred himself so re-rolls, and has a 1+ 5++ save. He is a combat beast and is also pretty cheap at 355 points. Probably one of the better value choices in the Special Characters section. Snagla Grobspit/Gtilla Da Hunter: Never used these, know little about them. Gtilla has a mediocre bow Magic Item and gives his Wolf Riders +1BS and Quick to Fire. Snagla has some pretty crappy magic items and allows his Spider Riders to Ambush and have Devastating Charge. Neither seem especially worth it to me. You can maybe get some utility out of them, particularly the Ambushers. They are essentially fancy expensive Big Bosses for your throwaway units.
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Post by Horace on Sept 18, 2018 15:59:37 GMT
Magic Items:
Battleaxe of the Last Waaagh: An extra D6 Strength and Attacks, for a penalty of half to your WS. It isn't a bad trade, it is simply the 100 point cost which makes this not worth it since it is your entire item allowance.
Basha's Axe of Stunty Smashin: Armour Piercing and +1 Strength & Attacks for 50 points. +2 if you are fighting Dwarfs. Not too bad in my opinion
Armour of Gork: Heavy Armour which grants +D3 Toughness and Impact Hits (D6). A cool Magic Item which sadly costs 100 points, Dammit.
Lucky Shrunken Head: Increases the Warpaint save to 5++. 4++ if Wurrzag is in the unit too.. because you would have 2 Savage Orc Shamans in the same unit.. Still an excellent item seen in most net-lists.
Bad Moon Banner: Makes the unit Stubborn and grants soft cover. Forces Dangerous Terrain Tests on any model which charges into contact with the unit. Shame not the entire unit then it would be more worth it. Bit steep at 50 points.
Skull Wand of Kaloth: Causes Terror and allows you to make a model in contact with your Shaman take a Ld test (unmodified) or be slain outright. But you don't really want anything you would want to use this on in contact with your shaman...
Spider Banner: Grants Goblin units Poisoned Attacks, and stacks with other Poison granting rules. Expensive at 85 points although I have heard of several people using this successfully for a surprise Goblin archer unit. Not my cup of tea.
Mork's War Banner: Grants Magic Resistance (D6) and deactivates any Magic Items that enemies bring into contact with the banner. Another horribly expensive item at 100 points, but one that I can see some utility for, especially for those Surprise! moments where you suddenly gimp your friends fancy general and brutally murderise him with your boyz.
Spells of Da Big Waaagh
Gaze of Mork (Sig Spell): Not especially great. Like a S4 4D6" cannonball bounce.
Brain Bursta: Allows you to snipe an enemy model with a S5 hit. Not bad because it's cheap to cast.
Fists of Gork: If your Shaman finds himself in combat (Savage ones often will), or it's late game and you need to tip the balance this can be quite useful. Gives the Shaman +3 Attacks and Strength and a 6++
Hand of Gork: One of the best spells in the lore in my opinion. Allows you to move units 3D6" or 5D6" depending on casting value. Only 9/14+ to cast too. Move Manglers etc around and watch your opponent wince.
'Eadbutt: Can be used to attack enemy wizards, inflicts a S4 hit with Multiple Wounds (D3), no armour saves allowed. It's alright I guess.
'Ere We Go: Allows all units within 12" to re-roll hits. Pretty decent.
Foot of Gork: The number 6 spell.. and it's a good one. Go stomping on your enemies with a template inflicting S6 Multiple Wounds (D3), and if you super boost it on a 4+ you can stomp again! don't roll a 1 though.. Excellent spell
Lore Attribute: If you have more units in combat than you do fleeing you get +1 Strength to your spells effects or bonuses. It's ok
Spells of Da Little Waaagh
Sneaky Stabbin' (Sig Spell): Grants Armour Piercing and re-rolls to hit & wound if you are attacking in the flank or rear. nothing to get too excited about.
Vindictive Glare: 2D6 S3 hit Magic Missile. At least it's only casting value 5+
Gift of the Spider God: Increases (or gives) Poisoned Attacks. Great for stacking with the Spider Banner or anything already poison. 8+ to cast, one of the better spells.
Itchy Nuisance: Reduces enemy Movement & Initiative by D6. Also works on Random Movers. Noice
Gork'll Fix It: the enemy unit must re-roll all to hit, wound & armour save rolls of a 6. Can be useful
Night Shroud: Basically gives you the Bad Moon Banner - the Stubborn. Can be boosted to effect all units within 12" which is slightly better. A bit situational.
Curse of Da Bad Moon: Another pretty decent number 6 spell. A Magical Vortex which forces a random characteristic test or suffer a wound with no armour saves. If this is boosted (to a miscast requiring 25+) however it uses the large template and lets you choose the characteristic (Strength, Toughness or Initiative). Can be a scary proposition.
Lore Attribute: On a 5+ you get to take one of your opponents Dispel dice and add it to your Power pool. Pretty cool, especially if you are using this lore on your secondary caster and are trying to draw dispel dice.
Overall the Lores are pretty strong in my opinion. The Big Waaagh has some pretty awesome spells in it, with Hand & Foot of Gork the highlights. Even the bad spells are alright. the Little Waaagh is a bit more of a mixed bag but is pretty cheap to cast. It is ideally suited to being used as a secondary caster backup lore, and the attribute gives you some nice synergy here.
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Post by saniles on Sept 18, 2018 16:27:24 GMT
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Post by Horace on Sept 21, 2018 13:05:34 GMT
The Orcs and Goblins book gives you a massive toolkit to play with. Whilst it doesn't have those "omg completely overpowered must select" units/characters, it has some pretty strong options which you will see taken in most competitive/net lists; Savage Orc Big 'Uns, Mangler Squigs, Doom Divers, Trolls etc. It is difficult to write a general strategy for this army because it can vary so much due to the large amount of options available, and net lists do not interest me in the slightest. However here are a few general points I usually follow.
In my opinion the greatest strength of O&G is the highly destructive units like Manglers/Fanatics/Pump Wagons etc etc which you can generally put down on the table pretty cheaply. You can place lots of High threat units which your opponent will have to try and work out how to remove before you get to him. If you are clever with this you can protect certain key models you wish to retain via target saturation and making sure your Manglers/Pump Wagons etc do not get removed by some crappy Light Cavalry throw-away unit. All the time they are focusing on these units your big mobs of boyz should be making their way across the table sharpish, getting ready to crump some heads.
With regards to your frontline infantry you have some pretty decent options. Plenty of cheap tarpit Night/Goblin units which can tie up the enemy, Savage Orc and Black Orcs which can be used to remove any high toughness/armour save units, anvils like Trolls (which should always be kept central to mitigate their stupidity) and Jack-of-all-trades units like Orc Boyz. Backing these up you have Squig Herds/Chariots/Boar Boyz which can be shunted forward to tip combats in your favour with their damage output.
With regards to flanks, there are several good options in Arrer Boyz, Boar Boyz, Giants, Chariots, Spiders etc. Just be careful about placing low Leadership models outside of the Ld bubble your General provides, and consider using Immune to Psychology units if you do to help prevent Panic!
Light Cavalry and War Machine hunters also have several good options in Wolf Riders, Spider riders, Squig Hoppers, Big Bosses on various mounts. Make sure you have some of these, not only for harassment but also to protect your Manglers etc
Orcs are in a bit of a middle ground in terms of characters They won't stand up to a Chaos Lord but they are fairly tough and strong. I always feel a bit light on protection with my Orcs & Goblins, but maybe that's because I feel this army is one which needs to be played offensively, crippling your enemies best units with destrutive units before finishing them off as quickly as possible before something goes wrong. Most of your army, and characters, are fairly low Leadership as most armies go. Between this and animosity, which is annoying but not the game destroyer some would have you believe, you do need to be wary of things turning against you very quickly. A simple panic test can result in a pretty calamitous chain of events which sees you snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
Because O&G are so cheap, I generally have lots of units to put down. This does put you at a disadvantage with regards to the first turn roll-off, but it does let you maximise your deployment. Protect what you need to protect, get your matchups in the correct places and mess up those enemy elites before they get to you!
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Post by knoffles on Sept 24, 2018 16:42:40 GMT
Horace nice review mate. I’ll add that you definitely need a sense of humour to play OnG’s. Life is cheap, especially those of the other boyz. In the 4th book Rick Priestly wrote a tactics article and a lot of that held true for later editions. I’ll dig it out at some point but one of the bits that stuck with me and I always found good advice, was he said take arrer boyz in similar blocks as normal boyz and treat the bows as an added bonus/threat.
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Post by Horace on Sept 24, 2018 17:09:36 GMT
Horace nice review mate. I’ll add that you definitely need a sense of humour to play OnG’s. Life is cheap, especially those of the other boyz. In the 4th book Rick Priestly wrote a tactics article and a lot of that held true for later editions. I’ll dig it out at some point but one of the bits that stuck with me and I always found good advice, was he said take arrer boyz in similar blocks as normal boyz and treat the bows as an added bonus/threat. I agree re Arrer Boyz. I have a block of 20 awaiting painting. If you don't engage them they continue to shoot your flanks!
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Post by Grimfang Gogulk on Jun 26, 2022 9:26:19 GMT
Nice write-up! I neer played that much 8th Ed so a good start for me. I just wish I could buy anything (new and cheap-ish) easily..
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simon
Full Member
Posts: 151
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Post by simon on Jun 28, 2022 14:22:47 GMT
Thanks for the write up Horace. I just wanted to check a couple of things. I believe Nasty Skulkers strike with 3 attacks each? (2 base + AHWs, correct me if I'm wrong). That’s 9 dice with ASF.. you’ll be hitting most characters on 5s, so realistically only 3 hits but still a 50/50 chance to KB a character before he even strikes… For 30 points.. I'd say that's definitely worth it as a nice little surprise. And if you're lucky you'll get a weaker wizard/hero with only WS4 and you'll be hitting on 4s.. Also you said Spear Chukkas are BS2, I think goblins are still BS3? Sorry to be that guy that points out the typos. Just checking that I'm not missing something myself!
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Post by lordofskullpass on Jun 29, 2022 8:43:59 GMT
I just wish I could buy anything (new and cheap-ish) easily.. In this day and age I have found that the most pragmatic option to go about expanding one's collection is to not be picky about getting stuff new or second-hand, because so long as it isn't fully-painted (which most stuff isn't given only a subset of the overall Warhammer playerbase is made up of dedicated painters ) second-hand stuff can easily be repurposed to be given the weapon options you want them to have (providing you have the bitz available). I recently managed to pick up 20 second-hand Boyz with additional hand weapons that I'm repurposing into Arrer Boyz with some bows from the ancient 5th-6th Edition Night Goblin kit, which have larger, ham-fisted hands that don't look hugely different from Orc hands, glued to Orc arms that had the original hands cut off at the wrist.
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simon
Full Member
Posts: 151
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Post by simon on Jun 29, 2022 11:52:51 GMT
In my opinion the greatest strength of O&G is the highly destructive units like Manglers/Fanatics/Pump Wagons etc etc which you can generally put down on the table pretty cheaply. You can place lots of High threat units which your opponent will have to try and work out how to remove before you get to him. If you are clever with this you can protect certain key models you wish to retain via target saturation and making sure your Manglers/Pump Wagons etc do not get removed by some crappy Light Cavalry throw-away unit. All the time they are focusing on these units your big mobs of boyz should be making their way across the table sharpish, getting ready to crump some heads. I'm in the process of planning an O&G army (been buying models for a while but yet to start painting). The above quote summarises my view also (as an O&G noob) of how best to play them, or at least how I want to play them (thanks again Horace). Has anyone here had success with a no war machines list? I am thinking two hard-as-nails blocks of orcs with a bunch of chaff and chaff clearance. What do people recommend for chaff-clearance? I think I'll need to clear the way forward for my orcs so they don't get fed expendable chaff all game. I really like pump wagons and manglers for chaff-clearance as your opponent can't do a flee reaction from a charge. Couple questions about random movement 1) if an enemy unit is already fleeing are they still prevented from taking a reaction (fleeing again)? 2) can you chose to remain stationary with a random movement model? I also like wolf chariots for their speed and points, to support the pump wagons and manglers, with wolf riders to help keep the manglers free from suicidal chaff! I like savage orc boar boyz too for this role as theyre immune to panic but a bit pricey compared to goblins. The overall plan would be to surge forward with lots of lone models (chariots/wagons, manglers, and maybe trolls too) for target saturation vs shooty armies or armies that want to back off and cast spells, paving the way for orcs to charge in turn 3. Versus other combat armies I would have to weigh up whether to take the charge with orcs and use chariots as flanking options or to put the chariots out front to soften up targets ahead of the orcs.
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Post by knoffles on Jul 3, 2022 18:02:25 GMT
simon you are right about the skulkers. 3 attacks each with the AHW. You mention about taking the charge with your Orc blocks. If it’s infantry then unless there is a downside to the placement of being charged, it doesn’t matter too much for the combat prowess as choppas works in the first round of combat whether you are charged or not. It’s why it’s such a great rule. I’ve also been a huge fan of pump wagons and wolf chariots in their lists since 3rd Ed. You can’t declare charge reactions vs random movers. Fleeing (whether as an optional or compulsory reaction), is still a reaction. So I’m pretty confident you would move into them and run them down in the same way that if you overrun/pursue into a fleeing foe you would run them down (as they also don’t get a charge reaction - brb pg 58)
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simon
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Posts: 151
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Post by simon on Jul 4, 2022 11:35:58 GMT
Thanks! I wonder also if you can choose not to move with a random mover and just stay still? I assume you can because the rule doesn't say you can't..
Yea the choppas rule is ace, particularly for big uns. My only issue with the book is that if you want to play orcs (as opposed to goblins) competitively the book encourages one big unit for core. Ideally I would like to have boyz and savages but because I am limited to only one unit of big uns it makes sense to just have one big unit instead of 2 medium sized units.. the difference between orcs and big uns being so great.. One big unit makes it easier to control animosity too. (And I know to become a true O&G player I should just forget about animosity and roll with it but I'm not there yet haha)
You mentioned 3rd ed.. I really like the orc models from that era, so much character to them. I think the modern orcs tend to all look the same, so a unit looks like it's the same orc in 10 different poses!
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