Post by sorenj on Aug 5, 2015 10:34:52 GMT
I said I was in for a bunch of comments, well here's another lot:
First off, I think we need to clarify what type of army Bretonnia is, what makes it fun to play and how does it play. My main concern and one of the reasons that I think GW abandoned the Brets is that it is not really unique. I can basically make a Bretonnian army using High Elves or Empire as well. Bretonnia is a strange mix of elite cavalry and poor infantry, the latter especially has little support or synergy with the rest of the army.
Looking at the recent armybooks like Lizardmen, Empire, Dark Elves there seems to be a general recipe for how to make armybooks. All have had additions in the chariot or large monster category like the Empire Celestial Hurricanum, the HE Scycutter and Phoenix and the Lizard Bastiladon. Fast cavalry and monstrous cavalry are also a common ingredient. All of these new ingredients offer some sort of support or buff to the existing core army, and this is what I think Bretonnia is missing. There's lots of core troops to choose from, but only the pegaus knights really stand apart. So I think some effort should be made to season up the Bretonnia. With that in mind I shall return to what makes the Brets special. Three tings come to mind:
- The siege theme; Trebuchet and archers with defensive stakes.
- Crusading theme; Grail knights, relics.
- Pegasus knights.
- okay there's actually a fourth: the Arthurian theme with the lady in the lake, but it seems this is mainly a fluff thing and rarely has any impact on the game - although perhaps it should.
Now Bretonnian purists will oppose my use of the word Crusading - and I know that they are not templar knights per say, but show people who are unfamiliar with Bretonnia a bunch of knights and say these are Grail Knights, most people will draw a mental reference to the christian crusades. Learn to live with it, accept it and embrace it.
So how could those three (four) themes be put to use?
The siege theme: I think Sappers would be a nice add on. (Sappers were medieval tunnelers that dug tunnels undermining castle walls). I imagine a bunch of soot and mud covered peasants that do a dirty and dangerous work for a few extra coins. Ruleswise a unit allowed to infiltrate armed with flaming crossbows. Perhaps a special rule that allows them to take down units in buildings and/or enemy warmachines. Their main purpose however is to deny opponents infiltrators to deploy near our knightly units.
I also imagine the Trebuchet crew are experts in attacking buildings and so hits from a Trebuchet do 2D6 hits to units in a building instead of the usual 1D6.
Crusading theme: Anyone seen the movie Kingdom of Heaven (of course you have). Well, who hasn't wanted to bring that big ass cross on a gaming table. Enter the Grand Reliqua; a chariot with some sort of giant holy relic. It should have special rules that boost other units, perhaps with a bound spell. The empire wagons should be easy to convert model wise.
Having mentioned the crusade I've basically also said the Plauge (as in the Black Death). Enter the Pestilant a (rare)unit of exiled and unwanted bunch of rabble that seek forgiveness for their sins against whatever and make remedy by taking up arms and fighting for a cause. They shouldn't be a copy of Skaven Plauge Monks nor the Empire Flagellants, but I think something in between could be quite fun.
Pegasus Knights: These guys speak for themselves, they're in it to win it. I wouldn't change anything about them really, except maybe allow the unit to be joined by characters like a wizard (Damsel).
Arthur / Lady in the Lake: I know there are already rules for questing vows, prayers and Lady's Boon, but all that is kind of invisible to your opponent, its a pregame thing. I think the Prophetesses and Damsels are obvious candidates for a tweek. Rules-wise I think its a good thing to keep them as wizards, but I feel like there should be something that sets them apart from other wizards as they are really a sort of priestesses. Perhaps a retinue of devoted maidens.
Edit: There really should be a mythical Creature of the Lake. I'm looking at you Kharibdyss conversion!
That's it for now, cheers.
First off, I think we need to clarify what type of army Bretonnia is, what makes it fun to play and how does it play. My main concern and one of the reasons that I think GW abandoned the Brets is that it is not really unique. I can basically make a Bretonnian army using High Elves or Empire as well. Bretonnia is a strange mix of elite cavalry and poor infantry, the latter especially has little support or synergy with the rest of the army.
Looking at the recent armybooks like Lizardmen, Empire, Dark Elves there seems to be a general recipe for how to make armybooks. All have had additions in the chariot or large monster category like the Empire Celestial Hurricanum, the HE Scycutter and Phoenix and the Lizard Bastiladon. Fast cavalry and monstrous cavalry are also a common ingredient. All of these new ingredients offer some sort of support or buff to the existing core army, and this is what I think Bretonnia is missing. There's lots of core troops to choose from, but only the pegaus knights really stand apart. So I think some effort should be made to season up the Bretonnia. With that in mind I shall return to what makes the Brets special. Three tings come to mind:
- The siege theme; Trebuchet and archers with defensive stakes.
- Crusading theme; Grail knights, relics.
- Pegasus knights.
- okay there's actually a fourth: the Arthurian theme with the lady in the lake, but it seems this is mainly a fluff thing and rarely has any impact on the game - although perhaps it should.
Now Bretonnian purists will oppose my use of the word Crusading - and I know that they are not templar knights per say, but show people who are unfamiliar with Bretonnia a bunch of knights and say these are Grail Knights, most people will draw a mental reference to the christian crusades. Learn to live with it, accept it and embrace it.
So how could those three (four) themes be put to use?
The siege theme: I think Sappers would be a nice add on. (Sappers were medieval tunnelers that dug tunnels undermining castle walls). I imagine a bunch of soot and mud covered peasants that do a dirty and dangerous work for a few extra coins. Ruleswise a unit allowed to infiltrate armed with flaming crossbows. Perhaps a special rule that allows them to take down units in buildings and/or enemy warmachines. Their main purpose however is to deny opponents infiltrators to deploy near our knightly units.
I also imagine the Trebuchet crew are experts in attacking buildings and so hits from a Trebuchet do 2D6 hits to units in a building instead of the usual 1D6.
Crusading theme: Anyone seen the movie Kingdom of Heaven (of course you have). Well, who hasn't wanted to bring that big ass cross on a gaming table. Enter the Grand Reliqua; a chariot with some sort of giant holy relic. It should have special rules that boost other units, perhaps with a bound spell. The empire wagons should be easy to convert model wise.
Having mentioned the crusade I've basically also said the Plauge (as in the Black Death). Enter the Pestilant a (rare)unit of exiled and unwanted bunch of rabble that seek forgiveness for their sins against whatever and make remedy by taking up arms and fighting for a cause. They shouldn't be a copy of Skaven Plauge Monks nor the Empire Flagellants, but I think something in between could be quite fun.
Pegasus Knights: These guys speak for themselves, they're in it to win it. I wouldn't change anything about them really, except maybe allow the unit to be joined by characters like a wizard (Damsel).
Arthur / Lady in the Lake: I know there are already rules for questing vows, prayers and Lady's Boon, but all that is kind of invisible to your opponent, its a pregame thing. I think the Prophetesses and Damsels are obvious candidates for a tweek. Rules-wise I think its a good thing to keep them as wizards, but I feel like there should be something that sets them apart from other wizards as they are really a sort of priestesses. Perhaps a retinue of devoted maidens.
Edit: There really should be a mythical Creature of the Lake. I'm looking at you Kharibdyss conversion!
That's it for now, cheers.